"Enterprise: The Romulan War"

[honeybee]

Which Daniels, episode, Warpgirl?

The corpse in Future Tense is from the far future, and has Vulcan DNA. But again, he's from the future. Daniels also says he has alien DNA (he claims he's more or less human) - but he's also from the far future.

Is there a time when Daniels says the interspecies mating happened during the ENT era? I may not be remembering correctly.

[Aikiweezie]

I still say that episode with Daniels makes the whole issue annoying. But I never thought Spock was the first.

What did T'Pol say? Wasn't there something with Archer where he wonders if a human-vulcan hybrid would have pointed ears? I can't remember exactly.

I wonder if cheez-its still has their "turn yourself into a Vulcan" website up? We can turn Connor Trinneer into a vulcan to see what Sodek looks like.

[WarpGirl]

Off to go find the transcript, BRB!

[honeybee]

If that's Future Tense, T'Pol is skeptical that the corpse is from the future, as she doesn't believe in time travel - yet. They are looking at the corpse's genome, and T'Pol says that attempts at Vulcan/Human mating have failed. Archer wonders about the pointed ear thing.

But again, the corpse they are looking at is from the far future, so it doesn't have any bearing on whether or not Vulcan/Human hybrids exist during the ENT era or even shortly thereafter.

I always thought that scene was a big, giant anvil that implied T'Pol would be the mother of the first known Vulcan human hybrid - which she seems to have been whether you count Lorian or Elizabeth.

[Aikiweezie]

I DID IT!!!! Trip, actually Connor Trinneer, as a Vulcan. It was very easy!

http://www.trekyourself.com/?mId=32040893.2

I have wasted waaaaaaaay too much time today over here! I'm hosting Bunco tonight and I have to clean my house!!!!!!

God, I hope CT never lurks around here. Between this and the covered in mud picture.....

[WarpGirl]

OK found it. And while it doesn't say that Vulcans never mated with humans before, it doesn't specifically state that they have either. I got from this that as far as T'Pol knows there aren't any human/Vulcan babies YET! But they could always try to pass the children off as fully Vulcan I suppose. Here's the dialouge and yes it's Future Tense...

ARCHER: That's because it hasn't been built yet.
T'POL: Few Vulcans have ever chosen to mate with another species.
ARCHER: Worried about contaminating your genome with a little human DNA?
T'POL: There are significant biological differences between the species. It's unlikely we could reproduce. Humans and Vulcans.
ARCHER: (searching for the TARDIS) That could be it.
T'POL: The dorsal section is the wrong shape.
ARCHER: (carries on scrolling through) If a human and a Vulcan did have a child, I wonder if he'd have pointed ears. There. I think that's it. Look at the commission date. That's almost nine hundred years from now. Daniels talked about historians from the future. People who traveled back to study the past. That could be what this pilot was doing.

[Aikiweezie]

OK found it. And while it doesn't say that Vulcans never mated with humans before, it doesn't specifically state that they have either. I got from this that as far as T'Pol knows there aren't any human/Vulcan babies YET! But they could always try to pass the children off as fully Vulcan I suppose. Here's the dialouge and yes it's Future Tense...

ARCHER: That's because it hasn't been built yet.
T'POL: Few Vulcans have ever chosen to mate with another species.
ARCHER: Worried about contaminating your genome with a little human DNA?
T'POL: There are significant biological differences between the species. It's unlikely we could reproduce. Humans and Vulcans.
ARCHER: (searching for the TARDIS) That could be it.
T'POL: The dorsal section is the wrong shape.
ARCHER: (carries on scrolling through) If a human and a Vulcan did have a child, I wonder if he'd have pointed ears. There. I think that's it. Look at the commission date. That's almost nine hundred years from now. Daniels talked about historians from the future. People who traveled back to study the past. That could be what this pilot was doing.

That doesn't necessarily mean that no one ever tried before Terra Prime, though. And she said this two years before E2. Maybe she got some new info by then. Still, this is a looong time before Spock.

[WarpGirl]

Did I say it was impossible? No. But the fact that E2 was more than a year before the VHC was overthrown, I have my doubts that there are any recorded human/Vulcan children before Lorien and Elizabeth. That's all.

[Reanok]

I like the Enterprise relaunch books and how the Romulan war we got to see Trip & T'pol's relationship explored more in depth. And I think the bond will have an important part to play in the next book it sure seems like it will, Hopefully since 2011 is Enterprise's 10 anniversary there will be more Enterprise books coming out that will explore Trip& T'Pol's relationship.The other series had books come out for Tng & Ds9 for their 10 and 20th anniversaries.I think Enterprise should get the chance for more books to come out than bok every year or two.

[WarpGirl]

I'd probably like the TnT parts. It's the rest of it that makes me leery. I'm not sure I'd like the rest of it. TnT scenes? Sure, who here wouldn't. But the actual story I'm not sure.

[honeybee]

I like the Enterprise relaunch books and how the Romulan war we got to see Trip & T'pol's relationship explored more in depth. And I think the bond will have an important part to play in the next book it sure seems like it will,

Absolutely, I think the way Martin used the bond was twofold - making them very together in those final scenes as well as indicating that this is in fact a Syrannite marriage that they are in. There's no indication that Y'cha and Denak were betrothed as children - their marriage is because of the bond that formed between them. Secondly, I don't think it's clear if Y'cha knows that TnT have bonded - and that might be a key that reveals whatever is going on in the spy plot.

I know someone expressed in the upthread that the bond was just used to further the plot in the previous books - which is kind of true - but it also was still presented as being very much there, which I like. But in this book, it's portrayed far more romantically.

I know Y'cha has mind melded with both Trip and T'Pol, but what she is doing and whether or not that would automatically reveal their bond is unknown. She had specific goals when she melded with each of them, and one of them was not discovering what their relationship is.

I would also not be knocked over with a feather if it turned out that Denak had also melded with T'Pol, and she does not remember it. There's no scene that indicates that, but it could have happened.

On the other hand, if either Y'cha or Denak knows about TnT's bond - they've got information that could be used against either of them or at the very least to manipulate them.

[WarpGirl]

So Y'cha and Denak are bad guys?

[honeybee]

Not necessarily - but they are clearly up to something - and both or one of them could be bad, good or grey. Their goals are just not necessarily TnT's goals.

[Silverbullet]

T-Pol says that there had never been a succesful human/Vulcan baby up to that point she is speaking historiicaly. so, there must have been Human/vulcan matings befor Ent. That does not mean that somewhere down the road in Ent she could be the Mother of the first one that lived. Besides Lorain and elizabeth. Just hadn't happened at the time of that Episode.

Think that Archer may have been hinting at a Hybred T-Pol/Archer baby. Remember in E2 the disappointed look on Archer's face when Phlox said that Lorain was the baby of t-POl and commander tucker.

[WarpGirl]

Hmm. Y'cha and Denak are not the most Vulcan names I've ever come across... Romulan/Vulcan Hybrids? I'm still leery. God I wish I could just make up my dang mind! It's just the last books I bought or borrowed ended up being wastes of my time! <pout>