Paxton's goal

[WarpGirl]

OK that almost made me laugh thanks for that.

[pdsldl]

PDSIL, didn't Phlox say the the Doctors who engineered Elizabeth made a mistake in the process.

It may have been on purpose but the way that phlox put it seemed to be saying it was a mistake that might have been made by anyone by accident.

Why would Paxton risk that? elizabeth was having problems and might have died before Paxton had a chance to use her.

True it could have been t ticking time bomb put into elizabeth to go off at a predetermined
moment.

We don't know but Paxton implied she wouldn't survive right after T'Pol confronted him about his Taggart's Syndrome. We don't know what he had in mind and if the cloning process was botched to accomplish this so as to say see this is what happens when you mix two species DNA.

[pdsldl]

Meats not going to recreate a being so any defects wouldn't be that big a deal. I have a big enough problem with the uses of real DNA and synthetic DNA is beyond scary. Paxton's insanity turned loss with computer generated DNA is creepy.

Also if they could recreate DNA with the computer then Sim wouldn't have been necessary because Phlox would just have create the brain tissue he needed with the computer.

That's why I want to believe it isn't possible. In the "Augment Arc" what Soong had was embryos. So it seems like you need the usual stuff. An ovule, at least.

Where did they find T'Pol's? Silverbullet theory works. Perhaps Phlox stored the samples of some crewmen after finding out that he had/will discover a technique to create hybrids like Lorian. But I can't think, for the life in me, a way to convince T'Pol to give an egg.

PHLOX: Sub-Commander, I need one of your ovules.
T'POL: I beg your pardon?
PHLOX: I need your ovules, one at least. I want to discover if Human/Vulcan procreation is possible.
T'POL: (after a freezing silence) Request denied.
PHLOX: Ohhh... C'mon, T'Pol...
T'POL: Of course not.
PHLOX: If you don't, I will tell everybody that you watched "LadyHawk".
T'POL: You wouldn't.
PHLOX: And you enjoyed it.
T'POL: How many ovules did you say?

I don't think so

Can't see that happening either. You need the nucleus of the cell from both parents to create a binary clone. Somehow they must be merged like in regular reproduction and then injected into a cell that has had its own nucleus removed. No special DNA required. Also the meat example doesn't work because the meat is not real its re sequenced protein made to approximate meat.

[Silverbullet]

What I don't know about Cloning would fill a library.

I know that there have been animals cloned here on Earth but for the life of me I really don't understand it all that much.

I would believe that making a single clone would be hard enough let alone a binary clone.

Srtill think the old fashioned way would be the way to go.

Getting the Egg and Sperm sample might pose some real problems.

At times I had wished that T-Pol and Trip had a real child on E terprise and it got kidnapped by Paxton and TNT rescued it with the Help of Arcer Reed and company.

That would have elimiarted all of this binary Cloone nonesense.

[Escriba]

The scary thing is that DNA is simple. I mean, it's simple chemistry, sugar and phosphates. So I want to believe that you'd need a complicated process rather than a "I have the code, I put the code into the computer, I press enter and I go to drink a coffe."

[Silverbullet]

I always loooked upon DNA as more than that.

to me DNA is the shcematic of a human being.

Chromosones are the Bllue Print to build the HUman but the DNA is the shcematic used to repair the Body.

So using the DNA, schematic, Paxton could replcate and build a clone and using DNA he would be sure he had the Schematic of both Trip and t-Pol. Still wonder how human elizabeth would be.

NIce thing about DNA, schematic, is that there are no chances of something going wrong like with Chromosomes. Unless there had been a mistake and apiece of the DNA had been left out.

apparently there are large sections of the double hilix that makes up DNA that Scientists are not sure of or if those are important. Engineers who cloned Elizabeth may have tired to eliminate useless parts of the double helix and goofed.

[pdsldl]

I'm leaning towards whatever process they used to get the nucleus to contain both Trip and T'Pol's DNA to create the baby as being what went wrong. Not sure how they'd get them to come together like a sperm and egg would the natural way. Don't think its just a matter of injecting one into the other. That's why I think they had to have blood to do it because they would have had to try several times before it worked at all and then several more times to get a viable fetus that survived to be a baby.

[Kevin Thomas Riley]

I don't remember exactly what was said about how Terra Prime got the genetic material, if it was even mentioned at all. But I think that Starfleet might have DNA samples stored off-ship for no other reason than being able to identify remains. So it's perfectly possible for some other Terra Prime spy to get hold of Trip's and T'Pol's DNA from there.

Masaro would be useful to 1) alert the Terra Primers about TnT, and 2) Copy the portions of Phlox's database that he got from his E2 self, detailing how Lorian was created.

[WarpGirl]

Paxton says that he aquired their DNA from an Operative on Enterprise.

[Kevin Thomas Riley]

Paxton says that he aquired their DNA from an Operative on Enterprise.

Ah, OK! Then my first theory fails. So Masaro was in all likelihood the one who stole the DNA too, as well as the info on Phlox's computer.

Or maybe there was a second Terra Primer on the Enterprise, with more easy access to Phlox and Sickbay? Hm, someone could write a fic about that...

[WarpGirl]

oooh oooh I am I am!

[Silverbullet]

Warpgirl, go for it.

will be eagerly waiting for it.

[WarpGirl]

Well it's a work in progress so don't kill me if you have to wait.

[Distracted]

The term "binary clone" is an oxymoron. I'm not a embryologist, but as far as I understand it, a "clone", by definition, is the result of a process whereby the genetic material (DNA...nucleus...whatever you want to call it) of a generic ovum of a given species is removed and replaced with the DNA of a somatic cell of the donor. Somatic, or regular body cells...as opposed to gametes like ova or sperm which contain only half of a person's chromosomes... have the complete set of chromosomes of the donor. Then the cell thus created is somehow induced to differentiate into an exact twin of the donor. The SINGLE donor.

When you're dealing with two donors you don't have a "clone". You have a genetically engineered individual which is the artificially created offspring of the donors. I would think that it would be necessary to create hundreds of embryos with many different combinations of genes, only a tiny percentage of which would survive without defects. The ethical problems this process would create would be horrible unless there was a way to map the genes and hypothesize probable outcomes, thus creating a computer program which could run through likely gestational results and choose the most theoretically successful ones to attempt in the lab. They'd still have to be willing to cull the fetuses that weren't perfect. The idea makes me queasy.

[WarpGirl]

And that is why it is ALWAYS good to have a doctor in the house. Great post Distracted!