DO YOU LIKE SIM?

[Aquarius]

^^Escriba, What puzzled me about the response to the story is that for a while, the vibe seemed to be that people felt T'Pol had somehow cheated on Trip, or that her experience with Sim would somehow diminish what she and Trip would have later on, like T'Pol did something wrong there or something. But she got something from Sim that she wouldn't get from Trip in quite a while: confirmation that what feelings she had for him were mutual. Sim had feelings for her and he told her, unlike Trip, whose feelings for T'Pol were still ambiguous at best, because Sim wasn't sure if his feelings originated from Trip or were completely his own, so Trip's still a big question mark here. I still contend nobody did anything wrong there.

[Escriba]

Lots of fic has been devoted about the consequences of her addiction and sleeping with Trip, from different point of view, because lot of people hated it so much and hated what it did to T'Pols character and the TnT-relationship. Maybe you could even say that T'Pol did pay in a way that her relationship with Trip was going downhill after that morning conversation.

Yep, very true. I guess for me that episode consolidated my view of T'Pol as a very immature woman in an emotional level. She gives the impression of having been very lonely all her life. Maybe she always felt very odd on Vulcan and possibly she lost her father at a very young age, which probably marked her profoundly. So when there is a chance for her to be happy... well, she acts like a scorpion. She is lucky that Trip is extremely loyal and stubborn.

I still contend nobody did anything wrong there.

But nobody did right either The thing is... well, I'm not going to rant at this point, suffice to say that I was writing a full journey for T'Pol (and Trip) to turn into an emotionally mature woman and make possible a mature relationship for her. Maturity is not always choosing right, maturity is to choose something and assume the consequences. Just because you've chosen wrong (or the wrong person), that doesn't make you unworthy. In fact, the trick about being able to choose, is that you can (and a lot of times will) choose wrong. As T'Pol says: "You are Human. You are free to choose." Well, she learns it the hard way.

[Aikiweezie]

Lots of fic has been devoted about the consequences of her addiction and sleeping with Trip, from different point of view, because lot of people hated it so much and hated what it did to T'Pols character and the TnT-relationship. Maybe you could even say that T'Pol did pay in a way that her relationship with Trip was going downhill after that morning conversation.

I can't say that I liked the way the two ended up in bed together, but I think it was inevitabile. And while I think T'Pol was not fully herself because of the Trellium, she wasn't "stoned." She was functioning, albeit with a whole new set of emotions swirling around inside her. Her behavior in Azati Prime and Damage were from the effects of withdrawl, not the drug itself.

And I agree with panyasan, T'Pol did not get off free afterwards. She already had feelings for Trip as evidenced (I think) by her behavio during Similitude. I don't think that was a pity kiss or tears on her part at all.

[Escriba]

Oh, no, no, for consequences I didn't mean she doesn't love him. No, she does. But she doesn't suffer any negative consequence from Trip: he doesn't stop talking to her or even trying to help her. She doesn't lose him. He doesn't remind her how she hurt him in any moment. It's as if T'Pol could retake the relationship or run away when she pleased. We don't really see any real consequence until "Affliction" and "Bound" when we see how a mind bond was formed between them. That's a real consequence because it's 1) problematic for T'Pol and 2) prove that T'Pol can't walk away when she wants.

[Aquarius]

I still contend nobody did anything wrong there.

But nobody did right either The thing is... well, I'm not going to rant at this point, suffice to say that I was writing a full journey for T'Pol (and Trip) to turn into an emotionally mature woman and make possible a mature relationship for her. Maturity is not always choosing right, maturity is to choose something and assume the consequences. Just because you've chosen wrong (or the wrong person), that doesn't make you unworthy. In fact, the trick about being able to choose, is that you can (and a lot of times will) choose wrong. As T'Pol says: "You are Human. You are free to choose." Well, she learns it the hard way.

But see, that's what's so great about it: the fact that it wasn't right, either!

This is how life unfolds!

A lot of people are upset about T'Pol's behavior in "Harbinger." I'm not. Why? Because I've been there and done that. When you're young and less mature it's easy to get caught up in the drama of relationships, especially when they're not quite going your way...I was in a similar situation where there was another female "threat" and I reacted. Not my best moment in life, but I don't feel I should be condemned for it either--hence, I don't think T'Pol should be condemned, the way some people do. Suffice it to say I'm MUCH older now and have the wisdom to know when to act and when to cut the line...but would I have become that woman without that reaction to that situation so many years ago? Some lessons need to be learned the hard way. And as for consequences, yeah, there have been some, and in T'Pol's case, her relationship with Trip is suffering because of her inexperience. She may be over 60 years old here, but obviously she's going to be developmentally behind when it comes to the emotional stuff, because she hasn't been dealing with that the way we do all our lives. It's like her body's being inhabited by a pubescent teenage girl who has all these feelings but doesn't understand them, or why she has them, but she just knows she has to do something.

So maybe I'm a little easy on T'Pol here, because I've walked a mile in her shoes.

[Aikiweezie]

So maybe I'm a little easy on T'Pol here, because I've walked a mile in her shoes.

Amen to that! I'm sure happy no one is on a bulletin board discussing the missteps of MY youth. Nobody is perfect.

[Silverbullet]

From what I have gather about your story is seems to me that T-Pol was just waiting for a reason to jump inot bed with SIM and finally found one in believeing that she "Owed" SIM for creating him and then dooming him.

That is why it seems like a Soaper to me.

BTW, this board is getting to me. I have tried to put up an Avatar. It may be that I do not have enough posts. But I tried to use pictures that I have used as AVATARs on other boards and no go.

I do see Avatars that are larger than the ones I wanted to use but when I try to use one I am told that they are not the right size.


What am I doing wrong, again

[Aquarius]

From what I have gather about your story is seems to me that T-Pol was just waiting for a reason to jump inot bed with SIM and finally found one in believeing that she "Owed" SIM for creating him and then dooming him.

That is why it seems like a Soaper to me.

Why not read Escriba's story and then decide? You may actually enjoy it.

As for the avatar issue, I believe you save the one you want to your hard drive. Then you can upload it through your profile page. It shouldn't have anything to do with your post count.

I'm kinda taking minor breaks from resume writing here and there so I'm a little busy at the moment, but perhaps if you're on later tonight I can help you out and walk you through it?

[Alelou]

Sometimes it's just a matter of making sure you input the exact size your avatar is where it asks. No one side can be more than 150 pixels, if I recall.

If all else fails, try a link from photobucket. That's what people with animated avatars do, because they can't be housed here.

[Silverbullet]

Stupided my way through the Avatar thing. course I may someday learn to read the instructios. You know the saying "If all else fails, read the Manual or instructions."

Thanks foryour help.

[Aquarius]

Oh, that's a nice one, too!

[Asso]

Oh, that's a nice one, too!

Yes.

[Aikiweezie]

Silverbullet, You put that together, right?

[Kevin Thomas Riley]

Silverbullet, You put that together, right?

Nope! The image manip was done years ago by a poster with the nick kashka at another board. From there I cropped and resized it.

And hi there, and welcome to the board, Silverbullet!

[WarpGirl]

But see, that's what's so great about it: the fact that it wasn't right, either! This is how life unfolds! A lot of people are upset about T'Pol's behavior in "Harbinger." I'm not. Why? Because I've been there and done that. When you're young and less mature it's easy to get caught up in the drama of relationships, especially when they're not quite going your way...I was in a similar situation where there was another female "threat" and I reacted. Not my best moment in life, but I don't feel I should be condemned for it either--hence, I don't think T'Pol should be condemned, the way some people do. Suffice it to say I'm MUCH older now and have the wisdom to know when to act and when to cut the line...but would I have become that woman without that reaction to that situation so many years ago? Some lessons need to be learned the hard way. And as for consequences, yeah, there have been some, and in T'Pol's case, her relationship with Trip is suffering because of her inexperience. She may be over 60 years old here, but obviously she's going to be developmentally behind when it comes to the emotional stuff, because she hasn't been dealing with that the way we do all our lives. It's like her body's being inhabited by a pubescent teenage girl who has all these feelings but doesn't understand them, or why she has them, but she just knows she has to do something. So maybe I'm a little easy on T'Pol here, because I've walked a mile in her shoes.

I don't condem T'Pol because she screwed up. I'm Ticked off at the B's because a Vulcan wouldn't have made that mistake. Do I think that she should screw up while falling in love with Trip? Uh yeah he's a completely different spieces and she has no rule book to go by. But I don't believe she had to go against her very nature as a Vulcan. There are some arguements that Vulcans don't engage in uncomitted sex because their physiology is hardwired for manogomy.

Look at poor Tuvok... He was stranded 75,000 lightyears away from home. Yes, he'd probably still be alive if it took 75 years to get home, but even he said the logical thing would be for T'Pel to assume he was dead, sever their bond, and remarry. But never once did he even consider mating with another. He had offers over the years, but he was reluctant even to use a hologram of his wife when his Pon Farr came around. I don't think that was all based on mere personal choice.

So no I don't condem T'Pol for making a GIGANTIC screw up. I blame the writers for disrespecting Vulcans.