New Member Recruitment

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Kotik

Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Kotik » Wed Feb 22, 2012 11:10 am

putaro wrote:
Kotik wrote:In all honesty, you won't attract too many new members, because we're all worshipping a product that has been ditched almost 7 years ago, so if anything, more activity has to come from already active members...


I disagree. I think there is still a significant amount of Enterprise Fan Fiction being written that could be posted here as well. ff.net doesn't provide much of a community for readers/writers, which is something that TRIS could focus on.


Of course there is still a lot of good material written, but I think it'll be hard to recruit new members for simple marketing reasons. We have our forum, which is a common feature of all relevant sites, except ff.net. Unfortunately that's where our main 'selling points' run out. Since I'm an entrepreneur myself, I tend to look at things from a marketing point of view. Let's have a look at the options that are available for the ENT fiction reader and author:

1. ff.net
FF.net doesn't have much of a community, but it is the best option for authors. You can publish yourself and even get detailled statistics about who reads what. This is why most of the authors publish there. Most of our authors do as well.

2. HoT
Although the site is dead, a lot of first-timers land there, because it tends to appear near the top of the list in search queries. I found TriS via HoT in 2009.

3. Delphic Expanse
Set up by some former TriS members, it features about the same services as our site, but apart from being run like a dictatorship, most of it's features are more convenient than over here. The publishing process is a bit more transparent, because people submit their stuff themselves. It is still reviewed by the administration, but one has the option of reviewing the status of the submitted text. The archive itself is somewhat cumbersome to use, but the reviewing process is much more sophisticated, especially with the option of author replies to comments. Our biggest advantage over DE is that we don't have a totalitarian administration and no censorship. My story "Words", which received favorable replies on both ff.net and here was rejected by the DE administration as not meeting their quality standards, so I think we are the better option despite the technologically less sophisticated environment.

4. Warp 5 complex
Technologically about the same standard as DE, the W5C is a viable competitor, although most people might be turned off by their huge amount of slash stories.

As we can see, we have three competitors for new members. Other smaller sites, like The Guardian of Forever seem to be inactive. So how do we fare against them? I'd say, from a marketing point of view, not too well. Our submission process is by far the most cumbersome of all available sites. Your submitted story might go up on the same day, but it may just as well take three weeks and too often stories appear misformatted in huge or tiny fonts. That's not down to laziness of all the volounteers in the administration team, but to the fact that too many steps are being done manually and the conversion software seems to be a complete bag 'o balls.
Our archive is simple and easy to use, but it lacks many features that are common at our competitors. If you look into our archive, you'll have no clue if an entry is a drabble or a multi-chaptered story. The genres as well aren't visible - only through a search or by opening the respective story. Our reviewing process is by far the least sophisticated and the most cumbersome of all competitors. Authors do not get any notification, have no way to reply and that's not even counting the horrible captcha thing and the fact that you lose your whole comment if you don't get the code right.
Our big selling point are the members. People like Silverbullet or Asso and his mediterranean flair are our biggest asset, but that doesn't count for new members, because they don't know them yet.

I've come up with a list of things that might make us more attractive for new members or for authors to come here from other sites:
  • The review option needs urgent remodelling. By introducing a login process for the archive or tying it to the forum membership, we could get rid of the captcha and more importantly, it would automatically introduce the technical option of sending a notification to the author, when a new review has been posted.
  • The submission process needs improvements. The simple option of adding pictures to stories and a slightly more detailed list of stories with basic informations á la ff.net and a better statistic might make us more attractive for authors.
  • The database could use an audit. We've been hit by connection problems quite often lately and several comments appear under the wrong stories, which means some foreign keys have been set incorrectly, which is due to the fact that MySQL doesn't support foreign key constraints, unless tables are stored using the InnoDB engine.

I've started programming a prototype for a revamped archive that I'll present in March, maybe that would be interesting for our programming team. I think that, if we provide a more convenient package, we might motivate more newcomers or established authors to come here or come back respectively, because like everyone else here, I'd be very sad if our favourite hideout would become deserted.

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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Distracted » Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:16 pm

Kotik, I certainly agree that it would be a shame if TriS became deserted, and I'm certain that you have some excellent ideas, but why don't you just contact mjimeyg and offer your assistance instead? Somehow I really don't think that presenting him with a completely different system- one which he has had no input in developing- and telling him, "Here. Use this. It's much better than the system YOU developed" is the most diplomatic way to go about it. :?
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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Alelou » Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:21 pm

Kotik, does it really help to see this as a competition?

I agree with some of your comments about where this site offers fewer features for authors and could be improved, but you've missed the main reason people hang out here -- they are TnT fans. We are the only active site focused on Trip and T'Pol. That's why I'm here (when I am).

When you talk about individual members as appealing to newcomers, you could just as easily talk about individual members turning off newcomers. Such is the dance of personality. God knows we have some strong ones.

There is no need to disparage other sites that have their own ways of doing things. I prefer to think of them as other lunch tables with their own social mores and social power structures. Some of us are good at going from table to table and getting along with everyone. Some of us are not so good at it or simply can't be bothered. (Raises hand on both counts.)

There's plenty of room for everyone, and I think we'd be poorer as fans without the diversity of sites. It's not like we're competing for ad dollars here. Let's just be happy there's enough interest in our show to support this many communities.
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Kotik

Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Kotik » Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:56 pm

Distracted wrote:Kotik, I certainly agree that it would be a shame if TriS became deserted, and I'm certain that you have some excellent ideas, but why don't you just contact mjimeyg and offer your assistance instead? Somehow I really don't think that presenting him with a completely different system- one which he has had no input in developing- and telling him, "Here. Use this. It's much better than the system YOU developed" is the most diplomatic way to go about it. :?


You misunderstood. The idea is not to present something and say "use this". The important word was prototype. It is a show case, not a complete system. The IT prople may ignore it, may have a look at it and develop it further or incorporate parts of it into the current system. If I just wanted to see my system in use, I'd be running it on an own site. I want to help. Pushing someone aside isn't the intention.

Alelou wrote:Kotik, does it really help to see this as a competition?

Well even if not for ad dollars, it is in fact a competition. Each site wants the same - attract new members - especially authors. Of course this doesn't mean that one site should work against the other, in fact cooperations usually yields the best results.

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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby panyasan » Wed Feb 22, 2012 7:50 pm

I agree with Kotik that improvement of the posting system would help to keep new writers when they start posting. I had a lot of troubles getting my stories up. Not only time wise (the longest wait was two months!), but sometimes the format was weird - bold letters, lots of spaces, but change wasn't possible. I am very grateful that TRIS post my stories, but these kind of things doesn't make it very encouraging to continue, even when I do.

Conclusion: I don't know if we are going to attract lots of new nembers in a very short time, but trying to improve the site - especially when it comes to stories - is a very good thing to do.
Last edited by panyasan on Thu Feb 23, 2012 6:38 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Asso » Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:29 pm

1)
Kotik wrote:...People like Silverbullet or Asso and his mediterranean flair are our biggest asset, but that doesn't count for new members, because they don't know them yet...

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2)
I do not know. Perhaps it is because Kotik and I live on the same side of the Atlantic Ocean and, in some way, we are not only geographically, but also, at least a little, ideally and mentally in sintony; in any case I am personally close to everything he says. It seems to me that his words are not interpreted in the right manner, that against his understandable and - let me say - commendable desire to offer his help for the empowerment of the site, it gets interposed a variety of non-small hurdles, resorting to strange and not easy to comprehend arguments.
At least, forgive me, this is the impression that I personally draw from the discussion in this thread.
If I'm wrong, I beg for pardon.
But please explain, because I do not understand.
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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Distracted » Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:33 pm

Kotik wrote: I want to help

I'm very glad to hear it. I will forward your offer to mjimeyg.
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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Elessar » Thu Feb 23, 2012 7:22 pm

I've just looked through this a couple of times to make sure I picked up on everything, particularly the high points and it sounds like what we can most immediately resolve is the posting frequency & scheduling. Changes have already been made to resolve that and get us back to the "at least once a week" basis we were once operating at. Again, what I think we could use most is a few more eyes & ears on the Admin staff that are regularly active. I admit, I hardly ever have time to just peruse the forums casually - but do from time to time to make sure we're not dead :popcorn: . But in all seriousness, obviously many members of the admin staff have had other diversions to pull them away from the work. I went through a period of boring, uninspiring employment that made it easy to be here every day. Now that I'm a full time graduate student, teaching and doing research and planning two international weddings - it is, admittedly, quite difficult to keep TriS priorities on the calendar sometimes. In the short term, the alarm bells have been sounded by some of my indispensably good friends - and I'm committed to getting things back on track. In the long term, we'll have to try and rebuild our moderator roster with some active people.

Let me remark on a few commonly noted issues:

- technical issues: I would agree with Kotik's first assessment that we're largely going to have to depend on a renewed sense of activity and enthusiasm from our existing membership base. When we say today that " a lot of people have moved on " it's almost a comically astronomical understatement, because by the time I made it to the fandom in Feb 2005, a whooole lot of people had left and moved by already! Attrition is something natural for a somewhat-small, insular fandom like ours, and I don't think fixing technical issues or rebuilding the system is going to increase our membership. That's not to say that those things are immaterial. They're important for keeping the present fanbase alive and interested in posting and writing - which is why the capcha "lost comment" has been fixed. Thank you, Mike.

If you have a prototype new dbase ready in March, I'll encourage him to take a look at it. Bear in mind it will take encouragement, which has nothing to do with anybody's estimation of your technical acumen, but rather your unfortunate habit of trying to ram it down somebody's throat and their natural reaction to want to piss on your head before giving your opinion a moment's consideration. Your concern for and dedication to improving the site's technical integrity is quite appreciated, and if things stay civil long enough we might get somewhere on improvements.

- New Moderatorship: D pretty well summed it up: so if you're interested, PM her and she'll pass the info on to me and we'll make every effort to make an expedited decision. Don't worry if you don't believe me, cuz D won't let me forget about it :rotflmao:

- The Facebook penny ads - we'll speak with Ek and get the run down on how she did this and I'll take out some more.

- Linking relationships : years ago, we went through a period where I was banging down every door of every site like ours for linking partnerships. Only a few ever responded, and this was before W5C, WWBJ or any of those other spinoffs existed. The one I really wanted was TrekUnited because they had such tremendous traffic - I'll knock on that door one more time.

On a side note I've just had a look over there - and it appears as though the 'Enterprise' section at TrekBBS is still decently active. HopefulRomantic is a forum moderator there now. I wonder how we could take advantage of this as a means of recruitment without just out-and-out stumping and trolling the name. We could just... band half a dozen of us together and go 'take over' the board over the weekend! :rotflmao: put up big TriS-Banner signatures (with a link of course!) and sort of plan a kind of "weekend sit-in" over there. Nothing disruptive, just creating new threads, stoking discussion, doing a lot of post-whoring. I know WarpGirl would be down! :guffaw: Thoughts?


Expand?
Ok so last but not least - the idea of theme diversification. We've talked this over long and hard among the admins, me and Ellie, and frankly haven't come to any conclusions so I need to hear your thoughts.

What we've been talking about is potentially expanding the TriS "site" community to include broader themes - what does this mean. Well, the first step would obv be going "full Enterprise" but frankly we've already kind of done that when we added "The Bridge" for general Ent fanfiction. That didn't occur with a tremendous amount of fanfare, however, I'm not sure how we'd get the word out that we have a vanilla Enterprise area now.

Even wider would of course mean "all of Star Trek" - who would be in favor of that?

The other alternative is the one that's going to have (I think) the larger potential for payoff but also a larger potential to not work out at all. And be very difficult to reach consensus on: and that's the idea of including an unrelated-but-popular fandom, interest in which is shared by many existing members. The thought process there is, maybe we can umbrella two fandoms under one roof and by including one that's bigger and more active and more fresh than TnT/Ent, we would get some cross-pollination whereby we generate new interest in Trip and T'Pol and Enterprise. Technically speaking, I can already tell that Kotik's going to have ideas how to do this :clap: , that's a big part of it really, is the way you integrated these two sites would be crucial to whether it worked. We hadn't actually sorted that out - I'm just sort of expanding publically to you all on what we've talked about so I can hear your thoughts - vehemently against, enthusiastically for, meh so-so?

So what fandoms have been proposed, well... there's 'big' but not necessarily 'active' like BSG (it is intriguing, however, to keep in mind that Battlestar Galactical: Blood & Chrome is on the way, late 2012 I think?). There's big and active but not sci-fi, like True Blood and also big, active and "sci-fi/fantasy" like The Walking Dead. There's active and sci-fi but not necessarily big and somewhat fragile still, like Terra Nova or Falling Skies. If we'd done this 3 or 4 years ago, we could potentially have gone Stargate (not sure how that would've worked out anyway after Universe tanked), so I don't think that Stargate is much of a viable option today (Gateworld is a GIGANTIC site with no problems staying busy, moving in on that would be near impossible). What else is there? I'm showing my bias here because I just mention the things I watch. It would probably be best to keep it sci-fi / fantasy unless there's a major interest in something non sci-fi. I mean there's LOTR with the Hobbit coming out, there's Game of Thrones, there's Twilight, there's...

Is there a way to pull off diversification? Would you support it, and to what degree? Those are my concerns.
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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby WarpGirl » Thu Feb 23, 2012 7:34 pm

Hey Boss! :wave: Okay first things first... Two International weddings! Holy Cow! Brave, brave, man.

Now about this remark...
Fearless Leader wrote:We could just... band half a dozen of us together and go 'take over' the board over the weekend! put up big TriS-Banner signatures (with a link of course!) and sort of plan a kind of "weekend sit-in" over there. Nothing disruptive, just creating new threads, stoking discussion, doing a lot of post-whoring. I know WarpGirl would be down! Thoughts?


What am I supposed to be down for? I don't know if you've noticed, but I haven't been really all that active around here, to be called a "post-whore." But if there's something I should be doing let me know.

To tell you the truth, I say since you pay for all this, you should do with it as you bloody well please!
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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby BolianAdmiral » Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:21 pm

Elessar wrote:So what fandoms have been proposed, well... there's 'big' but not necessarily 'active' like BSG (it is intriguing, however, to keep in mind that Battlestar Galactical: Blood & Chrome is on the way, late 2012 I think?).


I think that I could help with the BSG/nuBSG fan base, if you decide to include that universe here.

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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby panyasan » Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:29 pm

Very good news about the improvements when it comes to posting! Haven been at the TnT fandom since 2006 I know lots of people moved to other interest. But... for example on FFnet I still see a lot of them writing TnT stories and a lot of different, sometimes new people reviewing those stories. When all the improvements are in place, you may offer them A WRITER'S SPECIAL or some kind.

As for other sf-shows, besides doctor Who and other ST shows, none of those shows have my heart then ENT, Trip and T'Pol and their friends. I am also interest in writing and improve my writing, but that is a whole different topic.
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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Asso » Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:42 pm

Do you know? I'm in love with Trip and T'Pol (Er... with T'Pol, if I have to be honest. Trip? Well, good friend for me - and a rather lucky man , I must say. May he be damned! 8) )
Well yes. I continue to write. And on Fanfiction.Net, for those who want, it is possible to cast a glance at my latest efforts. We arrived to
The Ears of the Elves, chapter Forty-four


And here is the beginning of the whole story.
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But, I must say, you could also find something else on Fanfiction.net written by me. If you want.

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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Cogito » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:41 pm

For what it's worth, my opinion is that diluting the focus from TnT would be a mistake. I'm biassed, because I don't usually find non-TnT stories interesting (but there have been some great exceptions), but being able to come here and know I'm not going to trip over T'Pol involved with somebody else or well known characters suddenly and inexplicably turning out to be gay, is what makes this site attractive to me. There are plenty of other places I can already go to read that other stuff if that interested me.

The strongest aspect of this site IMO os the forum, and we don't make much mileage out of that.

The weakest is the experience that writers get. Hard to post stories, unpredictable delays, no way to correct the stories once they've been submitted, and above all no way to be told when people have been kind enough to leave comments. There are still quite a few people writing TnT stories on various sites. What I'd like to do is make the TriaxianSilk posting experience so positive for writers that this becomes their preferred place to post, rather than an afterthought.

In my view, where writers post new stories, readers will follow. Interest them in discussions about the stories and other topics, and some will stay and come to this of this place as their home in the trek 'verse, as I do.

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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Asso » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:44 pm

Cogito wrote:For what it's worth, my opinion is that diluting the focus from TnT would be a mistake. I'm biassed, because I don't usually find non-TnT stories interesting (but there have been some great exceptions), but being able to come here and know I'm not going to trip over T'Pol involved with somebody else or well known characters suddenly and inexplicably turning out to be gay, is what makes this site attractive to me. There are plenty of other places I can already go to read that other stuff if that interested me.

The strongest aspect of this site IMO os the forum, and we don't make much mileage out of that.

The weakest is the experience that writers get. Hard to post stories, unpredictable delays, no way to correct the stories once they've been submitted, and above all no way to be told when people have been kind enough to leave comments. There are still quite a few people writing TnT stories on various sites. What I'd like to do is make the TriaxianSilk posting experience so positive for writers that this becomes their preferred place to post, rather than an afterthought.

In my view, where writers post new stories, readers will follow. Interest them in discussions about the stories and other topics, and some will stay and come to this of this place as their home in the trek 'verse, as I do.

What he said.
Well yes. I continue to write. And on Fanfiction.Net, for those who want, it is possible to cast a glance at my latest efforts. We arrived to
The Ears of the Elves, chapter Forty-four


And here is the beginning of the whole story.
Image

But, I must say, you could also find something else on Fanfiction.net written by me. If you want.

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Re: New Member Recruitment

Postby Silverbullet » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:45 pm

I am all for anything that can save Trisilk. I would rather it not be changed too much. Keep it a Tnt site.

I have, in my small way, tried to buck up Trisilk when I thught it was wavering and about to go down.

What I am absolutely am against is opening it up to Slash, thressomes or A/T. Sorry but none of those things were represented in the series. Not even hinted at. so, keep it clean.

If you are going to have certain parameters hold to them, don't abvolsve anyone because they may be a site donor. Donating is a volunteering to help pay for the site it is not a free pass to write and post things that are prohibited.

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