Archer as Captain

[ginamr]

But mostly I'm with Panyasan, I just got tired of being "told" how great he was. We're all know that the number 1 rule for story telling is show don't tell. But it rarely happened on screen. We were "told" Archer and T'Pol had a bond of deep respect and friendship, by V'Lar. We were "told" that Archer would be the founding father of the Federation. We were "told" he was a great leader and begining to become a great diplomat, but I never saw it. After a while, I didn't believe it.

I agree with a lot of the analysis here. Archer was pretty much Mr. Invincible and the others were just second stage compared to his storylines. I still feel they could have expounded on the other characters more. Travis, of course, was left out. Mostly I would have liked to see a bit more one-on-one interaction between Malcolm and his parents. That and a little more about what he did as an operative.

Hoshi's character was very inconsistent. Personally, I would have stuck with one or the other--afraid and facing her fears bravely or afraid and struggling to face her fears, then either conquering them or not. It's okay to see the characters fail in the short term as long as they triumph in the long term...grow as people.

Actually, one of the few characters that I thought was well rounded in that series at all was Phlox. You got to see a bit of what family life was like for him, you got to see his heroic side, you got to see him struggle over the death of a colleague, you got to watch him care for Sim as he grew up...you saw multiple sides of his character: father, husband, doctor, friend, conqueror of obstacles. He was a great character.

[WarpGirl]

[Misplaced]

But mostly I'm with Panyasan, I just got tired of being "told" how great he was. We're all know that the number 1 rule for story telling is show don't tell. But it rarely happened on screen. We were "told" Archer and T'Pol had a bond of deep respect and friendship, by V'Lar. We were "told" that Archer would be the founding father of the Federation. We were "told" he was a great leader and begining to become a great diplomat, but I never saw it. After a while, I didn't believe it.

I agree with a lot of the analysis here. Archer was pretty much Mr. Invincible and the others were just second stage compared to his storylines. I still feel they could have expounded on the other characters more. Travis, of course, was left out. Mostly I would have liked to see a bit more one-on-one interaction between Malcolm and his parents. That and a little more about what he did as an operative.

Hoshi's character was very inconsistent. Personally, I would have stuck with one or the other--afraid and facing her fears bravely or afraid and struggling to face her fears, then either conquering them or not. It's okay to see the characters fail in the short term as long as they triumph in the long term...grow as people.

Actually, one of the few characters that I thought was well rounded in that series at all was Phlox. You got to see a bit of what family life was like for him, you got to see his heroic side, you got to see him struggle over the death of a colleague, you got to watch him care for Sim as he grew up...you saw multiple sides of his character: father, husband, doctor, friend, conqueror of obstacles. He was a great character.

Word.

[WarpGirl]

You know what would have saved Archer for me, (no not his death, I'm not that evil) but I would have loved for him to have to offer real support to the other characters instead of being supported by them. I tell ya just watching Amok Time the other day blew my mind. I wasn't even watching for Kirk, I was watching for Lirpa fight moves... (And now I am very depressed) but watching Kirk offer true support in spite of the craziness to Spock was awe inspiring. I'm sorry, but The Seventh, and Stigma, and Desert Crossing, do not count.

Now I'm not sure if it was the writing or Scott Bakula's acting, or what it was... But none of those episodes touched my heart the way Kirk and Spock did in Amok Time.

That and Scott Bakula didn't know how to deliver his teasing lines. Like the time in Rogue Planet when he tells Malcolm to "Let me be the Captain for a while" it came off as snide, not funny. Unlike Kirk getting one over on Scotty, or Spock.

[aadarshinah]

It was definately the writing. Bakula's been quite good in some of the other things he's been in. I think the problem though was that Archer knew how to command and honestly wanted to help, but really didn't know how to go about doing it. Sheltered son of Henry Archer and all of that.

On a side note, according to my mom, my great-grandmother used to be Bakula's father's secretary in the 80s. It doesn't really have anything to do with anything, but it's very odd how these things work out.

[WarpGirl]

Cool!

I totally admit I'm not a Scott Bakula fan, but I never thought he was a horrible actor. Just one that never pulled me in. I just don't get a magnetic sense of Charisma like I do with someone Avery Brooks and I do not watch DS9. To me the Captain should have something that makes you think Ah I know why they follow him! even if you don't like the character. I never got that with Scott Bakula. The guy who played Tolaris sucked me in, and I hate that smarmy rapist character.

[Silverbullet]

It could have been a combination of direction, writing and acting. Lots of times an Actor and a Director have differfent ideas on how a character should be portrayed. Writers too have their ideas. The ideas don't always meld.

There were times when I thought that Bakkula had phoned in his part. That he wasn't into the Episode. He probably got a bit burned out for a while. He did carry the lions shae of every episode except for a very few. Even then he was featured in the end of the episode.

I will say that I wish they had allowed Conner more screen time and a few eisodes with just him and JB. Conner was too good to be wasted as he was.

[WarpGirl]

You're right of course. I remember reading about certain TNG episodes that the whole cast hated, or a director that nobody liked to work with. But on the whole even with episodes the cast doesn't like, and they happened on all the Treks most of the time, they pulled it together and stayed in character. I just got the sense it was harder for Mr. Bakula at times. Probably because the poor man didn't know how to be in character, with the inconsitancy that he had to deal with. I truly feel bad for him about that. But then I think the entire cast had problems with certain episodes. Anyone remember The Communicator?

There is also the possibility the B's resented any imput. Le'Var Burton said that it had been a problem for years. Especially Mr. Burman. That said, whoever came up with Season 4 Archer, might have been projecting their own fantasy as a SF captain...

PS. I don't think Mr. Bakula was thrilled about playing the water polo fan scenes. I just never bought it.

[enterprikayak]

I think he got spoiled on Quantum Leap and couldn't stop acting like a different personality each week. Wouldn't that explain the whole thing perfectly?

[aadarshinah]

I think he got spoiled on Quantum Leap and couldn't stop acting like a different personality each week. Wouldn't that explain the whole thing perfectly?

Yes! Perfectly!

[Brandyjane]

Now I'm not sure if it was the writing or Scott Bakula's acting, or what it was... But none of those episodes touched my heart the way Kirk and Spock did in Amok Time.

That and Scott Bakula didn't know how to deliver his teasing lines. Like the time in Rogue Planet when he tells Malcolm to "Let me be the Captain for a while" it came off as snide, not funny. Unlike Kirk getting one over on Scotty, or Spock.

Yes! In fact, I remember watching "Broken Bow" the first time it aired and thinking that something was off with the way he delivered the line to Trip about scratching the paint on the bottom of the ship during their inspection. It was a funny line, but it came across weirdly stilted, in my opinion. I know there were some other scenes like that, but my I haven't had my coffee yet and I can't think clearly yet. I just decided to ignore that weird delivery of some lines, though, so that when Archer does say or do something kind or funny I just assume its sincere. I want to like Archer, and I do like Bakula.

I think he got spoiled on Quantum Leap and couldn't stop acting like a different personality each week. Wouldn't that explain the whole thing perfectly?

[WarpGirl]

Yes! In fact, I remember watching "Broken Bow" the first time it aired and thinking that something was off with the way he delivered the line to Trip about scratching the paint on the bottom of the ship during their inspection. It was a funny line, but it came across weirdly stilted, in my opinion. I know there were some other scenes like that, but my I haven't had my coffee yet and I can't think clearly yet. I just decided to ignore that weird delivery of some lines, though, so that when Archer does say or do something kind or funny I just assume its sincere. I want to like Archer, and I do like Bakula.

Well, I find it hard to laugh when I'm not sure something is meant to be funny. Honestly, although I was disappointed with Scott Bakula being cast, I really, really wanted to give him a chance in the begining. And I tried so hard too, then came Rogue Planet, and... well I gave up. However... Extinction was a remarkable proformance by Mr. Bakula, I thought he deserved an award for it.

I think he got spoiled on Quantum Leap and couldn't stop acting like a different personality each week. Wouldn't that explain the whole thing perfectly?

Maybe I sould have watched Quantum Leap as a kid, but it never interested me at all.

[Silverbullet]

Only time I had a real problem with Bakkula's delivery was in Breaking hte Ice. In the scene at the captans mess Bakkula ruined a couple lines tragically.

One thing I did notice and it may have been pushed by the writers and directors. Bakkula jerked his head when he wanted to do something dramatic. He often did that. it ws annoying to me. Conner could use his whole face or his eyes to get a dramatic effect but Bakkula didn't seem to have that in Enterpise. Quantum Leap he never jerked his head that I remember. Sad to say but of the entire cast I thought that Bakkula gave the worst performance. True, had one Hell of a lot of liines and action to remember it may have been a drag at times. In other series some of the actors seemed to have phoned in a performace or two. Must be a Bear doing a series week after week. Not the same as acting on stage every night though.

I think it might have been depressing to the other Actors to be relegated to a cardboard cut out status always to only make the Hero look better.

[Brandyjane]

Maybe I sould have watched Quantum Leap as a kid, but it never interested me at all.

It never interested me as a kid, either. I didn't discover it until a few months before Enterprise first aired. I watched re-runs everyday on Sci-Fi to unwind when I got home from work. (This was pre-marriage, pre-kid, even pre-roommate, so I could do things like that back then.) I enjoyed it a lot, so I was so excited to learn Bakula had been cast as the lead in a Star Trek series. I still can't picture anyone else in the role of Jonathan Archer, but really was disappointed with the performance. I had such high hopes.

I noticed that head-jerking thing too, Silverbullet. It was kind of weird.

[WarpGirl]

Quantum Leap would confuse me kind of like Doctor Who confuses me. I didn't want Scott Bakula as Captian because to me he's Mary-Jo's cheating jackass ex-husband on Designing Women. And the impression stuck even though he was a Trek character.