Any hope for the New Star Trek movie?

[Rigil Kent]

And even if it is bad, I still will love it. Quietly..y'know, to myself (if it's really bad), but really, for me Trek can do no wrong.

Please please please don't take this the wrong way, but that's part of the problem. We've become so accustomed to swallowing the crap that they offer as "good" Trek that many of us have stopped demanding that the movie/show actually be good. Look at how poorly ENT was done in the beginning ... does anyone seriously think that, if changes weren't mandated by the studio come season 3, that the Beebs wouldn't have kept plodding on, shoveling substandard scripts and episodes at us? I have absolutely no doubt that they would have remained at that pathetically low quality (The Seventh, A Night in Sickbay, Bounty, etc. etc.) with the rare gems in there when they got someone who actually gave a damn. Compare the first season of ENT with the first season of nuBSG ... the latter so much better quality wise that it hurts.

It's the same thing with the Star Wars prequels. They sucked because the guy in charge had lost touch and the people underneath him were afraid to say "Sir, this blows righteous chunks into next November." But, people went to see that because of the label ... even when they were thinking "Man ... this kinda stinks..."

I know I may take some flak for this, and I really hope that I don't offend anyone, but simply watching a show or movie because of a title or link to the franchise isn't enough. I need more than just the Trek name. I need a solid script (i.e. one that doesn't rely on the characters being stupid to advance the story ala Fusion) and solid actors (not blocks of wood that can talk ... sometimes. Hayden Christensen of EpII & EpIII, I'm looking at you.) I don't know about you, but I don't want to watch another Nemesis or Insurrection. I want another Wrath of Khan, dammit. Another The Empire Strikes Back or Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World (but in space!) I'm tired of Hollywood peddling crap in place of good movies.

End Rant. I sincerely hope that I haven't offended anyone ...

[CX]

For what it's worth, I have your back.

[JadziaKathryn]

It's been ages since I saw Insurrection, but I liked it. Of course, this was before I entered my thinking-while-watching-TV/movies phase. (Which, incidentally, you helped spark, Rigil, CX, KTR.) From what I remember it was decent. The premise was fascinating.

I see what you guys are saying from both sides. Honestly, I go to the movies next to never (last time was a year ago), but for a Trek movie I probably will. However, I do think sometimes TPTB think, "If it's Star Trek, fans will come," and therefore don't worry about other stuff, like a good script.

[Rigil Kent]

It's been ages since I saw Insurrection, but I liked it. Of course, this was before I entered my thinking-while-watching-TV/movies phase. (Which, incidentally, you helped spark, Rigil, CX, KTR.)

Um ... you're welcome?

From what I remember it was decent. The premise was fascinating.

I watched it on DVD and didn't like it. Not as much as Nemesis (which I flat out loathed), but I really, really didn't like it.

However, I do think sometimes TPTB think, "If it's Star Trek, fans will come," and therefore don't worry about other stuff, like a good script.

I suspect that they think that all the time. But that's just my opinion and worth exactly nothing.

[JadziaKathryn]

I watched it on DVD and didn't like it. Not as much as Nemesis (which I flat out loathed), but I really, really didn't like it.

Why not?

[CX]

I didn't much like it either. There was too much injected silliness for one, and the subplot Data had with that little kid was pretty weak too, but mostly I just didn't think much of the story itself as very good, not to mention that parts of it didn't make sense (ike their explanation for the origin of the Sona (sp?). It wasn't as horrible as NEM, which I haven't watched since the first time in the theaters, but it was still very eye roll inducing.

[enterprikayak]

And even if it is bad, I still will love it. Quietly..y'know, to myself (if it's really bad), but really, for me Trek can do no wrong.

Please please please don't take this the wrong way, but that's part of the problem...I know I may take some flak for this, and I really hope that I don't offend anyone....
End Rant. I sincerely hope that I haven't offended anyone ...

{{^^^1st of all, unlike many bulletinBoarders out there in cyberspace (trek or otherwise) I am nearly totally and completely uninsultable.
Try it. Go on.
Ah, GOOD one! But, see? See? Rolls right off my back. No worries.}}

However, since no one from the Trek franchise ever asks me for suggestions (hmph!), I cannot do any realworld harm by being pointlessly and slavishly devoted to said franchise.

I know it's that "can one person make a difference" debate...I do agree one can, and I do recycle my used pop cans with this in mind... but with trek I feel that I'm a total Canadian nonentity in the face of its USA-based creations; and so my slavish, freaklike devotion shall continue on, even if there are more discriminating souls who can look up and judge what they're eating whilst gobbling.

Trek? I just gobble blindly. Anything they put in front of me. Even if I recognise that it's a little strange, you know, that the turbolift with Picard and the kids in it would "fall" down the shaft with no gravity. (Perhaps they PUT grav plating under the lifts on purpose just to add to the spicy life of space-faring adventurers.) Even if he's fighting with some energy creature that looks like the Gorn's half sister. I still giggle and hug myself and note the errors and mistakes and giggle and hug more insanely. Darmok at Tonagra! Worf's "cloned" spinal cord spaghetti noodle! Sisko's funny way of talking like he just ate far too much hot soup! O'Brien's continually and inexplicably morphing rank! The Universal Magic Translator! T'Pol's/Seven's/Troi's ubiquitous sexy-ass pink/teal/sparkly tittysuits! Kes' thick, cotton PreschoolFashions!

It's like a crazy family member and I just can't wait to see what crazy crap he's going to pull next: speaking with the words of god or eating & flinging his own feces: I just love that big disabled brother of mine, Star Trek.

I know I can admit this here because I am among freaks and friends.

My favourite Trek book? The nitpicker's guide by Phil Farrand. I guess I feel that the loving and totally forgiving tongue-in-cheek nitpicking is part of what MAKES Trek great in my opinion.

In 1993, at age 13, I even submitted my own nitpick for season 7 of tng (the book came out in season 6) and the author used it for Volume II.
(MY PUBLISHED NITPICK: Deanna says in "Masks" something to the effect of "like the sun and moon, only one can be in the sky at a time". Except that the mask culture was from light-years away and who knows what their suns/moons did? And even on earth, the sun and the moon are always hanging out together in the sky.)

I got a credit at the end of the book (admittedly along with 100's of others) and my brain melted from TrekPleasure.

Any wonder I should become a TrekPleasure!writer? S'not my fault.

[TSara]

And even if it is bad, I still will love it. Quietly..y'know, to myself (if it's really bad), but really, for me Trek can do no wrong. If you can accept the Gorn creature on TOS, you just suspend disbelief and become addicted. The Beebs have tested my total acceptance theory a few times, of course, but in general......

Weird. I have 19 hours of *random* music on my playlist right now and I log on for five minutes and the long version of Faith of the Heart starts after I log on. Weird. Staaaaaar Treeeeek!

(Faith of the Heart: another thing I secretly and shamefully liked whilst others around me squealed and wailed. Husband parodies it horribly and dramatically {to which I usually shriek: don't make fun of my SHOW! He never listens.})

Heh....I'm a freak too than.....because I like FOTH too. lol

I hated it when I first heard it on the pilot episode.....but after awhile I started to like it.....so much so I wanted them to change it back after they changed it again in the 3rd season.

And yes.....It's on my Ipod too! Along with the theme from TNG's The Inner Light.....LOVE that score.


Tis a good thing my Hubby likes Trek.


And this I just hafta ask.........Do any of you thinK the powers at be have ANY idea how much the fans are divided???


I mean....you have fans who hate what's been done to the franchise.....but at the same time out of sake of loyalty or being curious they will continue to watch the show or go see a new movie.

And than other fans are so upset about it that they just say the hell with it and refuse to go see it unless it's as good as it used to be.

Neither side is wrong for feeling the way they do......but I wonder if the "powers of trek" are as clueless as they seem to be...or if it's just an act.

[CoffeeCat]

I know I may take some flak for this, and I really hope that I don't offend anyone, but simply watching a show or movie because of a title or link to the franchise isn't enough....

How can I argue with someone who speaks the truth?

[evcake]

Enterprikayak: thanks for your post. It's the funnest thing I've read for a while. A breath of fresh air, laced with nitrous oxide.
Give me good Trek, give me bad Trek, just don't take my Trek away.

[TSara]

I know I may take some flak for this, and I really hope that I don't offend anyone, but simply watching a show or movie because of a title or link to the franchise isn't enough....

How can I argue with someone who speaks the truth?

How to say this......I did not like Enterprise when it first came out at all.

It didn't seem like a prequel to me.....it seemed too hi-tech to be a prequel.

The fact that the powers at be pushed if off as a prequel when in my mind there was no way it could be with all the modern looking computer screens and special effects really pissed me off.

But after awhile I did start to like Enterprise. This took some effort on my part and I still in many ways do not consider it a prequel.

So I guess in some ways I sold out.....but I for one don't regret that I like the show.

I about the same problems Trek has like everyone else. *nods*

I'd love nothing better to tell Paramount this face to face......I doubt I'll ever have a chance to.

I know, I know I could protest by not going with the flow...But I honestly also feel that unless I give it a chance I'll have no idea if I will like it or not.

Bah.... does that make sense?

[CX]

To be honest, I don't consider ENT canon. That's the only way I was able to get over my own dislike of that aspect of it. TnT helped make it enjoyable too, though that hasn't aged well as I've had time to think things over. Mostly I think it's a matter of how seriously one take it all. Some people see it as a joke, some people see it as an an enjoyable joke they can laugh with instead of at, some people take it seriously. I'm one of the ones that takes it seriously. Honestly, I think the only reason a lot of people don't take it seriously is because it's sci fi, and for some mysterious reason the prevailing attitude is that sci fi as a genre can't be taken seriously. Me, I think drama is drama, regardless of the setting, and it either sucks or it doesn't, regardless of the genre.

[CoffeeCat]

You guys lost me. I can't even reconcile Star Trek: The Next Generation with TOS, never mind Enterprise....

[CX]

To be honest, even the first couple of seasons of TNG I take worth a grain of salt until it finds something more ... solid. For instance, in Encounter at Farpoint, Data mentions being part of the class of '79 because the timing of the series hadn't been worked out yet, and it had simply been assumed that TNG too place exactly 400 years in the future, in much the same way as TOS was supposed to be exactly 300 years in the future. Plus it just lets me ignore inconsistancies like that.

[Jedikatie]

I never had a problem with Enterprise being a prequel. Seriously, you can't expect their tech to be more primitive than TOS's and expect the show to be taken seriously in this day and age. The jelly bean controls and whatnot on TOS, in fact, have always looked more than a little silly to me, personally.

Yeah, I know why they did it (because of wanting to show off the series in technicolor) and to supposedly make it look futuristic--but it doesn't come across that way, not to today's audience. If you tried to make something look more primitive than that, most of the casual viewers would likely just roll their eyes and change the station without even bothering to watch. (That's not to say that they wouldn't do it anyway, once they realized it was Star Trek, mind.) And quite probably a good number of the newer generation of Trek fans would as well, that didn't grow up with Kirk and company as the only crew of Enterprise, who hadn't seen or cared very much about TOS and thought the show basically started with TNG.

I mean, for example, how much more primitive can you really make the medical monitors in Sickbay look? :shrug: The ones McCoy had were essentially little dials that bobbed up and down, and that's it. It's kind of hard to get more primitive than that. And it's way behind what we have in now. At least Phlox's monitors tried to hold true to the image of McCoy's, with the little digital dials monitoring the patients' heartrate, etc., but it also used stuff that we've developed since then so it doesn't look utterly dated before the series even aired.