Janeway/Seven?

[CX]

You know, I keep seeing this pop up on various websites, and the latest was actually a place that had a ton of ENT reviews on it. Basically where this came up was in a review that explained everything that was wrong with Endgame, because people like me need this explained to them, because we weren't really into VOY that much. Anyway, every once in a while there's be a mention or joke about Janeway/Seven, and at some points he'd even seriously advocate that TPTB should've done more with that. I guess my question is then where J/7 even comes into play, because to be honest, I actually did watch VOY in its entirety when it first aired, and I never saw any kind of romantic or sexual aspect to Janeway trying to teach her what it means to be human again. Could someone clue me in here about this?

[CoffeeCat]

You're right, CX - it's just that Voyager fans are all Tri-sexual, as in, they'll try anything - so they tend to min and match.

[Distracted]

There were a couple of episodes that gave me the feeling that someone was pushing that subtext, but of course nothing overt. I think DS9 was the only ST series to go there, and even that was with an alien who'd been both genders at some point in his/her life and just happened to be in a female body at the time (Dax). I don't think the viewing audience was quite ready for an overt same gender relationship when Voyager originally aired, "Ellen" notwithstanding, and especially not with the captain involved.

I've seen some interesting fanfics, though. "Better Living Through Treksmut" or BLTS, has quite a few Janeway/Seven fics. How do I know this? Well... ummm... the moderator asked to archive my fics and I said yes, so I visited the site to check out what she'd done with them and my little eyes went like

I haven't visited the site in a while. But some of it kinda grows on you. I liked the Spock/Christine Chapel stories. Wasn't too crazy about the idea of Spock/Kirk, though.

[CX]

Can you tell me which instances involved subtext that way? It's been forever since I've seen anything of VOY.

[Kevin Thomas Riley]

Well, I'm not the one to ask. I saw VOY in its entirety and never even knew there was such a thing as a Janeway/Chuckles until I saw it online... let alone a J/7!

[Distracted]

Janeway/Chuckles! Ewww. A psychopath is just the person I'd pair the captain with. Greeeat. I'd rather read Spock/Kirk.

I don't remember the name of the episode, but I distinctly remember at least one scene where Janeway is standing by Seven's regeneration niche and all but tucks her in for the night. It could be interpreted as maternal... but I got a weird vibe when I watched it.

[CX]

If I did a reboot, part of me would almost be tempted to do that 'ship, but on the other hand that would be creepy because of the teacher/student aspect to it.

[JadziaKathryn]

Janeway/Chuckles! Ewww. A psychopath is just the person I'd pair the captain with. Greeeat. I'd rather read Spock/Kirk.

Um, how was Chakotay a psychopath?

I am against J/7 for multiple reasons. First of all, slash is one of my pet peeves because it's saying, "Let's take canon and throw it out the window! Who needs to be in character?" Then there's the mentoring relationship which is just so very wrong to mix with romance.

That said, I remember reading somewhere that there's a scene from "Someone to Watch Over Me" where Seven helps Janeway attach a missing rank pip and some people see slashy subtext there. When I watched it, I saw a little bit more of a relationship of equals than had previously been portrayed, but I certainly didn't see flirting. *shudder* I guess diehard J/7 people could see it that way, though.

CoffeeCat is right about VOY fans. On the whole, they are some of the most weird people about pairing. It's not just that there are some people committed to a slash, a la Kirk/Spock fans or even the T/R fans of ENT. No, these people (I generalize) will pair anyone with anyone. For example, let's consider Janeway pairings. There's Janeway/Chakotay, Janeway/Paris, Janeway/Torres, Janeway/Seven, Janeway/Doctor, Janeway/Tuvok, Janeway/Kim, and I think once I saw a Janeway/Chakotay/Seven.

It's insanity, I tell you.

[Distracted]

Chuckles isn't Chakotay. That pairing is canon, or at least could have been if they hadn't been rescued. No, there was some insane clown in one episode who was killing people. He was a psychopath. Or did I just imagine that?

[JadziaKathryn]

Oh, okay. Right. Chuckles is Chakotay. That's what Q called him once, and the name has stuck some in the fanfic community. Particularly among people who aren't his greatest fans.

However, you didn't imagine "The Thaw," which I thought was an excellent episode. That did have an insane clown, but he didn't have a name other than Fear, IIRC.

I saw VOY in its entirety and never even knew there was such a thing as a Janeway/Chuckles until I saw it online... let alone a J/7!

I'm pretty sure KTR was referring to Chakotay, not Fear. But how he watched the whole series and didn't get a hint of J/C I don't know, unless he missed "Resolutions" where they were stranded together.

[HopefulRomantic]

...But how he watched the whole series and didn't get a hint of J/C I don't know, unless he missed "Resolutions" where they were stranded together.

Or Coda, with Chakotay cradling the dead Janeway in his arms and weeping over her...

[Linda]

I see the Chakotay/Janeway romance in the same way as the Archer/T'Pol one. Canon suggests it in one episode but does not take it anywhere in later episodes. Were the series creators testing the fan reaction to this possibility and then when it didn't seem to take with the fans, move on to different pairings? Or were they just trying to come up with new material to fill out the season's episode quota and just planning this abortive romance as a one shot deal? They kinda did this with Spock too in TOS, probably many other main characters that I cannot think of off the top of my head at the moment. It is lunchtime and I am hungry. Gotta go eat something!

[Asso]

I think you are right, Linda.
And I, too, am hungry now!
Bon appetit!

[Distracted]

Oh, okay. Right. Chuckles is Chakotay. That's what Q called him once, and the name has stuck some in the fanfic community. Particularly among people who aren't his greatest fans.

However, you didn't imagine "The Thaw," which I thought was an excellent episode. That did have an insane clown, but he didn't have a name other than Fear, IIRC.

Oh. Sorry. I guess I'm not much of a fan, then. I saw "Chuckles" and immediately thought it was the clown.

[JadziaKathryn]

Were the series creators testing the fan reaction to this possibility and then when it didn't seem to take with the fans, move on to different pairings?

But it took on in a huge way!