My VOY reviews

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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby CoffeeCat » Sun Aug 18, 2013 1:29 pm

CX wrote:Maybe no one else has an interest in writing them? :dunno:

Or maybe no one wants to base their fiction off her reboot nonsense because she assassinated the characters *that bad*.

Either way, I was thinking about going in and taking that niche. It's wide open.
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Kevin Thomas Riley » Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:18 pm

Oh damn! There's a scratch on my season two disc two so I can't watch it. :evil: Luckily there are, ehum... alternatives... :shifty:

*****

1-15 Jetrel

This was another surprisingly good outing for Voyager, trying to replicate some of the emotion of the excellent Duet from Deep Space Nine. It doesn’t succeed all the way though, in no small measure because they made Neelix the main character. Given that he's been the annoying comic relief up until now, it is a bit hard to take him seriously as this troubled war veteran, even if it does give him some welcome depth.

The parallels between the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the metreon cascade on the Talaxian moon, and between Robert Oppenheimer and Jetrel, are almost all too obvious, and quite deliberate by the writers, but they work here. Some of Jetrel's utterings comes directly from Dr. Oppenheimer (like "brighter than a thousand suns").

Jetrel is ultimately a tragic character, about to die from metreon poisoning and trying to overcome his guilt by trying (and failing) to restore his victims from the metreon clouds around the Talaxian moon. And Neelix has to come to terms with the fact that he survived the war by running away from it.

Jetrel gets a grade of 7+ from me.

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1-16 Learning Curve

This must be one of the weakest season finales on Star Trek since Shades of Gray in the second season of The Next Generation, although Learning Curve isn't nearly as bad as that one was. But as a hook to entice viewers to come back it utterly fails. I should note that this first season has been a shorted one since the pilot aired mid-season in January 1995, thus only encompassing 15 episodes instead of the regular 26. In some markets another four episodes from the second season where added to the first, making The 37's the finale.

Anyway, this episode is also the final episode where there is some Starfleet/Maquis tension. After this that whole premise for the show is more or less gone, which is a real shame. I would think that tensions would rise the longer they remained stranded in the Delta quadrant, probably with some Starfleet personnel also getting tired of Janeway way of doing things, but no…

Even the rebellious Maquis in this episode are rather weak. Their insubordination is wholly mundane and not very serious. And they put rigid Tuvok in charge of disciplining them like raw cadets, running laps and cleaning with the equivalent of toothbrushes. I'm sorry but it should be obvious you can't treat grown men like that and except good results. And it was fairly predictable that some external threat would make them all come around and bond, including Tuvok.

As for the b-plot I found that one completely ridiculous. Fermenting cheese infects the gel-pack circuitry! Come on! And has there been any cheesier line (pardon the pun) on Voyager than Torres: "Get the cheese to sickbay"? Finally, the teaser once again depicts a scene from Janeway's Gothic holo-novel that has no bearing whatsoever to the rest of the story.

The first season of Voyager thus ends on a real low note as I give Learning Curve a mere grade of 1+ on my 10-graded scale.

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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Weeble » Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:28 pm

I truly enjoy the reviews KTR. I rarely if ever watched Voyager, and you are certainly saving me the trouble now.
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Alelou » Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:04 pm

I'm literally just not remembering most of these episodes, even though I'm sure I saw them.

I think Jeri Taylor must have a weakness for gothic romance. That's the only way to explain that TNG episode with Beverly Crusher and the gaggy Scottish ghost. Those two genres just don't cross over very well, if you ask me. The most successful form of it I ever saw Trek try was the Expanse episode with Hoshi and the Beast, and even then I found it pretty annoying.

I guess the Trelayne episode on TOS might count, too, but they played up the anachronistic weirdness and menace of the setting all the way through instead of wallowing in the romantic elements of it.
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Asso » Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:46 pm

Alelou wrote:I think Jeri Taylor must have a weakness for gothic romance. That's the only way to explain that TNG episode with Beverly Crusher and the gaggy Scottish ghost. Those two genres just don't cross over very well, if you ask me. The most successful form of it I ever saw Trek try was the Expanse episode with Hoshi and the Beast, and even then I found it pretty annoying.

Obvious that you say this, Alelou. It seems to me that you, my friend, are inclined to the perspicuity rather than to the shade (this, at least, is my impression, and it is not a criticism, absolutely not). But this does not mean that Gothicism and science fiction (better, in my opinion, the pseudo-science fiction, because this is, in fact, Star Trek, again in my view) can not go hand in hand. Indeed, if we are honest, the origins of science fiction and Gothicism (in the broadest sense of the term) are common, not to say that in a sense they are the same thing.
Of course, this does not mean that the episode you mentioned was a good episode: but - what do you want? - the fact is that (still in my view) Hoshi fits to nothing.
But this (again my opinion) is true for all the characters of Enterprise. They, all of them, after all, fit to nothing: they - allow me - are neither fish nor fowl.
There was, in fact, something with great potential and I think you all know who I am referring to: Trip and T'Pol.
A lot of wasted potential, though.
Still in my view.
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Weeble » Sun Aug 18, 2013 8:29 pm

I thought the "Tremayne" aka Liberace episode was a good one. Especially when the parents intervened at the end. It was the forerunner to "Q". I also tend to cut TOS a ton of slack due to the limited special effects available, the worst being the bipedal "Gorn", but what the hell.
Asso, I thought "Exile" was terrific. Who knows, perhaps Tarquin may reappear in a future Weeble chapter....
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Asso » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:00 pm

Weeble wrote:I thought the "Tremayne" aka Liberace episode was a good one. Especially when the parents intervened at the end. It was the forerunner to "Q". I also tend to cut TOS a ton of slack due to the limited special effects available, the worst being the bipedal "Gorn", but what the hell.

How true! :lol:

Weeble wrote:Asso, I thought "Exile" was terrific. Who knows, perhaps Tarquin may reappear in a future Weeble chapter....

Go for it! :clap:
Well yes. I continue to write. And on Fanfiction.Net, for those who want, it is possible to cast a glance at my latest efforts. We arrived to
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But, I must say, you could also find something else on Fanfiction.net written by me. If you want.

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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Alelou » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:18 pm

Asso, I can see science fantasy and gothic romance having a great deal in common. Science fiction and gothic romance? Not so much.

At any rate, Star Trek has usually resided on the brightly-lit, technobabbling, not-so-atmospheric side of things. If they go into a fog-shrouded world of dastardly heroes and villains, it's usually played as creepy or menacing, and they always return back to their brightly lit starship. Beverly's willing crossover into the misty world in that TNG episode -- and the suggestion that their practical-minded doctor had actually grown up that way -- struck me as really weird.

Then again, I was also quite upset on Jean-Luc's behalf. 8)
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Asso » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:39 pm

Alelou wrote:Asso, I can see science fantasy and gothic romance having a great deal in common. Science fiction and gothic romance? Not so much.

Why not? I do not see many difficulties.
Ah, I have to give it for granted that you do not feed on some great propensity for my "In the Hall of the Mountain King". :shifty:
Well, not quite "Gothic Romance", to tell the truth, but at least a little,I think it can perceived as such a thing. :angel: :twisted:
Last edited by Asso on Mon Aug 19, 2013 6:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
Well yes. I continue to write. And on Fanfiction.Net, for those who want, it is possible to cast a glance at my latest efforts. We arrived to
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But, I must say, you could also find something else on Fanfiction.net written by me. If you want.

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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Kevin Thomas Riley » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:48 pm

Alelou wrote:I think Jeri Taylor must have a weakness for gothic romance. That's the only way to explain that TNG episode with Beverly Crusher and the gaggy Scottish ghost.

That's accurate. Jeri's fondness for Gothic novels is mentioned on Memory Alpha. And as you say, she also wrote Sub Rosa on TNG.

(I get some tidbits for my reviews from Memory Alpha)
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Kevin Thomas Riley » Mon Aug 19, 2013 8:08 pm

Season one overview

It shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone that I found the first season of Voyager a big disappointment. In fact I found the entire series a big disappointment. No, the big surprise here is that the first season was actually better than I remembered it, at least when I tally up the grades (a 4.40 average). The Next Generation's first season was much, much worse (2.78), and it was on par with the first season of Deep Space Nine (4.82). It is still a below average grade of 4+ though.

My main beef is that the showrunners never allowed for the show's premise to work. We have a ship and crew cut away from home and everything still feels like they could run into Picard and the Enterprise next week. They pay lip service to shortages but it doesn't really show, apart from having Neelix as a cook so there won't be a strain on the replicators. Everything still looks nice and tidy. And the inherent conflict between Starfleet and Maquis personnel is soon forgotten, so what was even the point of having it in the first place when you don't dare to do something interesting about it? Most stories could also just as readily have taken place on any other Trek show. They even keep overusing the holodeck! And the technobabble… God, the technobabble! I think Voyager is the show that takes it to the extreme.

The characters are generally not very interesting. Either they're too annoying or crazy but often they're just boring. In that I'm reminded of The Next Generation.

I will make no secret of the fact that I really don't like Kathryn Janeway, which is a shame considering she's the first female Captain on a Trek show. But she annoyed me to no end, starting with her mannerisms but most of all how inconsistent she was. Some Trek fans have resorted to calling her Insaneway and I'm bound to agree. She often makes rash and stupid decisions on a personal whim and she, and her crew, are often saved by virtue of blind luck, or just for plot reasons. And it starts already in the pilot episode.

Chakotay is another letdown. In the first couple of episodes he is more independent and resourceful, standing up for his Maquis compatriots, but he quickly turn into Janeway's lapdog and yes-man. After that he more or less a non-entity with some spiritual Indian characteristics tacked on much like his face tattoo.

Tom Paris was also an interesting character at first, with his chequered past and the resentment he initially got from Starfleet and Maquis both. But that was soon forgotten as well. He struck up a nice friendship with Harry Kim though, even if Kim wasn't (and won't be) a very interesting character.

I like Vulcan and Vulcans but Tuvok bores me. He is and always will be a stoic stiff. Trek has had interesting Vulcans before, but alas Tuvok isn't one of them. He's just too one note for that.

But I have to admit having a soft spot for B'Elanna Torres, clichéd as her character is with amalgamating a feisty Latin and Klingon persona. And for some reason I find Roxann Dawson more attractive with her Klingon forehead than without.

One character I do like is the holographic Doctor, with his grumpy personality. Heh, maybe because I can relate? He is probably my favourite character on Voyager.

Neelix, however, is not. He's the Jar-Jar Binks of this show, perpetually annoying in almost all the things he does. Or considering he pre-dates the Star Wars prequels, one could say Jar-Jar was the Neelix of the Star Wars prequels. And don't get me started on the inherent creepiness of his relationship with the very much younger Kes. I get the plot reasons for them to have a native guide, but why someone like Neelix? Kes, while cute, doesn't stick out much as a character. She occasionally makes herself useful when she's interacting with the Doctor.

I do like the look of the ship, an Intrepid-class vessel, especially the exterior. The interior is still a bit like hotel lounge, but at least I don't get the luxury liner feel I did from the Enterprise-D. I also think Voyager has the best intro of any of the Trek series. Great theme and visuals.
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby CoffeeCat » Mon Aug 19, 2013 8:50 pm

Yah, KTR. If they had just attempted to live up to their premise, maybe they wouldn't have needed a borg with implant hooters to save their show.

Rick Berman should have fired both his producers after the first season tanked. What I don't understand is how the actors always come under fire (poor Jennifer Lien) for the shows failures when it's clearly sloppy writing and lack of direction from behind the scenes.
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Transwarp » Mon Aug 19, 2013 9:02 pm

KTR, I love your reviews. They are witty, informative, well-written and, as an added bonus, I mostly agree with your conclusions.

Personally, of the TNG, DS9 and VOY triad, Voyager was my favorite. I think this is because of Paris, Torres, 7of9 and the doctor. Janeway was OK; I certainly didn't find her as arrogant as Picard or as boring as Cisco. Chakotay and Tuvok were somewhere between 'meh' and 'blech'. Neelix, on the other hand... Neelix needed to be shown to the nearest airlock... without a spacesuit.

So: TNG had Wesley Crusher. DS9 had Quark. And Voy had Neelix. Which raises the obvious question: Was there some network directive or requirement that each series have an obnoxious, fingernails-on-the-blackboard annoying character that made people want to throw things at their TV? (If not, then how do you account for them?) When I first saw ENT, I was afraid Phlox was going to be the mandatory annoying character. Miracle of miracles, he was not! In fact, it appears (unless you want to make a case for Super!Archer) that ENT managed to avoid this particular plague.

And ENT didn't have the holodeck, thereby cementing its position as my favorite Star Trek.
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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Asso » Mon Aug 19, 2013 9:25 pm

Mh ... I must say that, personaly, I find Phlox rather arrogant and overconfident. Even too curt and hasty.
I would not entrust myself to a doctor like him.
But, maybe, I wouldn't entrust myself to any doctor. :twisted:
Well yes. I continue to write. And on Fanfiction.Net, for those who want, it is possible to cast a glance at my latest efforts. We arrived to
The Ears of the Elves, chapter Forty-four


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But, I must say, you could also find something else on Fanfiction.net written by me. If you want.

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Re: My VOY reviews

Postby Kevin Thomas Riley » Tue Aug 20, 2013 12:26 am

CoffeeCat wrote:Yah, KTR. If they had just attempted to live up to their premise, maybe they wouldn't have needed a borg with implant hooters to save their show.

The more I watch early VOY the more I cannot wait until they get to Borg space and we meet 7of9.

Transwarp wrote:KTR, I love your reviews. They are witty, informative, well-written and, as an added bonus, I mostly agree with your conclusions.

Why thank you, kind sir! :)

Personally, of the TNG, DS9 and VOY triad, Voyager was my favorite. I think this is because of Paris, Torres, 7of9 and the doctor. Janeway was OK; I certainly didn't find her as arrogant as Picard or as boring as Cisco. Chakotay and Tuvok were somewhere between 'meh' and 'blech'. Neelix, on the other hand... Neelix needed to be shown to the nearest airlock... without a spacesuit.

You know the odd-even rule of the Star Trek movies, right? That the even-numbered ones are good and the odd ones not so much... Well, I'm kind of like that when it come to the Trek TV shows, albeit in reverse. The odd ones are the best - TOS, DS9, ENT - and the even ones less so - TNG, VOY. A lot of that has to do with the characters. I think that TOS, DS9 and ENT by far had the best characters. There are some good one son the other shows as well, like Worf or The Doctor, but they are mostly exceptions.

So: TNG had Wesley Crusher. DS9 had Quark. And Voy had Neelix. Which raises the obvious question: Was there some network directive or requirement that each series have an obnoxious, fingernails-on-the-blackboard annoying character that made people want to throw things at their TV? (If not, then how do you account for them?) When I first saw ENT, I was afraid Phlox was going to be the mandatory annoying character. Miracle of miracles, he was not! In fact, it appears (unless you want to make a case for Super!Archer) that ENT managed to avoid this particular plague..

Heh, maybe your right about that. Although I did like Quark. It was mostly the other Ferengis I couldn't stand (and Lwaxana Troi).

Asso wrote:But, maybe, I wouldn't entrust myself to any doctor. :twisted:

You know what they say, Doctors make the worst patients...! ;-)
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