"The Abomination"

[Silverbullet]

No, but you accused me of constantly brining it up. Saying that it is getting old. I don't believe that I amguilty of that. I couldn't remember where the actual discussion took place or I would have put the comment there. That was amistake on my part. But I have not driven it in tothe ground or harped on it constantly.

SB

[WarpGirl]

It's actually very common for people to graduate highschool at 17 heck my sister did! I couldn't do it early too many hospital stays. So I can totally buy Trip getting out at 17. Military or not Starfleet has the influence to get any training they want for their people in any way they see fit. Can we at least all agree on that. Me I'm going with the theory that during ENT they're like the coast guard only they do a much better job.

[Alelou]

That's a good point. I've had a fair number of 17-year-old students in Freshman English at the colllege.

[WarpGirl]

Thank you. Nice to know I occasionally have one.

[Thot]

I still like the "it's a generally known legend, which sounds so convincing at the first time, but simply isn't true" idea concerning Trip's education.

There are so many cases, where most people think about historical aspects in a specific way, although historians generally known it simply isn't true like the connection people do with burning of witches and the Middle Ages: The first known massiv burning of witches was 1428 and its general peak was during the 16th and 17th century and not during the Middle Ages. So in fact the Renaissance and the early age of Enlightment were the zenith of the burning of witches!
Or the fact that in 1/3 of all the cases, where someone was burned as a witch, the victim was a man!
Those facts don't change the situation, how most people think about it: Middle Ages=dark ages, because of burning of witches

Additionally like Riker said in the abonimation: "it's a historical holoprogramm" with a clear intention to be used as a counseling tool. Just like 'historical novels' today, those are based on historical events, but don't contain a one-to-one representation of the events. Well it would be a different case, if they had said "historical (holo-)documentation", but they didn't.

You know, guys, the irony in my case is that this episode is the reason I even started to read fanfiction let alone write it myself.
I was so shocked after the end of the episode, that I seached through the internet to buy the dvds of the next season and then I was even more shocked, that there wasn't another one...
Then I found fansites and then fanfiction and then started to read it and so on...
I'm sure I would have never started it without this trigger of the abonimation.
What a irony, isn't it?

[WarpGirl]

Well *the_abomination* started me reading fanfiction, but not because I saw it. I was crusing around ST.com after it got cancled, and happily in denial ENT even existed, becase season 2 killed any interest in it for me. But I stumble on Trip's picture, and because I think CT's hot and I did love Trip, I clicked. imagine ny shock and rage when I read... Charles Tucker III born 2121 died 2160!!!!! What the H-E- Double hockey-sticks!!!!!!!!!!! Was pretty much my reaction. So enter google, found HoT and migrated here, and finally decided to watch and write last year.

[Thot]

Well, I have another story about it:

My flat mate, who wasn't that much interested in Star Trek, got interested after I had told him a few aspects about Enterprise. So I gave him the DVDs and we watched most of it together. Although he made some comments about the inconsistencies and some plot holes in the stories - which for some part I shared - he said, that it's good stuff, specially the third and some of the forth season.
And then we approached the final episode and I warned him, if he really likes the series, he should perhaps skip the last one. He only replied something like "Oh, don't exaggerate so much" with a smile.

Well after the episode he said: "I never thought I would say that but... you should have been more persistent with your warnings!" This smiley represents his expression quite good:

End of the story: Until today he is still a little bit angry with me for not protecting him from it with more determinition. And he isn't even a fan of Star Trek.
What else do I have to say?

At least I could use this experience in another case, where I lend the series to someone else and told him the incident with my flat mate, whereupon this one decided to skip the last episode.

[WarpGirl]

OK call this utter blasphemy, although I think I've uttered worse... But I was more angry about Shran when I finally saw it. I mean from all the fic I know people were mad about Trip. And believe me I was. But when I actually saw what they did to Shran that's when I completely lost it, and what little respect I had for TPTB. Shran was amazing, if the show didn't have Trip I would have watched it for Shran. And what they did to him turned me into a raving psycho for a few minutes. I scared my cat so bad.

[Rigil Kent]

So I wasn't really posting (or even lurking, really) when Aquarius began this thread, but I figure that I should just jump in feet first.

On one hand, I loath this ... episode with every fiber of my being because of all the reasons previously stated by others, but on the other hand ... it was this episode that actually led to me actually publishing something for mass consumption (or as mass as our little corner of fandom can be), so I guess there is some good that came out of this dross. Unlike some, I wasn't forewarned about what a disjointed, insulting mess this episode was before it originally aired since I wasn't the spoiler whore I've become since. In fact, now that I think about it, this tripe is probably the reason I'm such a spoiler whore because if an episode of a show sucks this badly, I want time to prepare myself.

Anyway, I went into it totally unready for what it was and, after "Terra Prime" ended, I was actually looking forward to what I erroneously believed was "Part 3." Boy, was I surprised.

Afterward, I got online and discovered HoT and their "Fix the F**knale" challenge, which led to my original offering (I think it's called "A Necessary Deception" now, but was originally something like "Truth and Lies" or something equally trite. Avoid it because, IMO, it kinda sucks.) Still unsatisfied, I started outlining a far different and more ambitious story, one where I wrote what I would have liked to have seen as the final episode rather than ... that. This was the original incarnation of Elysium (which has been altered somewhat with my decision to continue the story with the Endeavour series.)

But even now, as much as I loath this so-called finale, I occasionally have new Fix-Fics come to mind (one I call "Renatus", another ... doesn't have a name even if it has a plot), so I guess it wasn't a total waste.

Well, it was waste (of the fecal matter sort), but I guess MythBusters showed me that you really can polish a turd.

[WarpGirl]

Hey I liked your origional Finale fix Rigil! I still do actually. I guess you could say you helped draw me into the nut house here. You're pretty inspiring.

[panyasan]

I teach journalism and creative writing classes - and I treat my students as though I was an editor.

They are expected to produce real articles, usually researched on campus. I always tell them that the scale isn't important - write about your dorm if you need to - but the form and content and editorial process will be the same when you get out into the professional world. I always hear - my interviewee didn't show up or one of my sources lied to me - these are lessons I can't teach them. I just need to force them to do the work, so if and when they do get a "real" assignment - they have a sense of what is expected and what can happen.

On the other hand, I often assign readings - mostly literary journalism - that is beyond the comfort zone and experience of my students - and that is something a classroom can offer. Exposure to ideas/work that might be outside the narrow focus of whatever job you get. So, I'm going to go with a mixture of field experience and theory/classroom stuff. I better since that's how a run my classes.

I am late for this discussion, but this really made me think about a discussion we had in language school. Bascially, when you learn about a language it's not only words and grammar and reading, it's going out there and try to speak the language. In school you saw people who were very good in learning the language, but were sometimes a bit disrespectful of the people and culture of the language they were learning (a big no no in my book) and they were praised. In contrast we had people that learn the language by just try to have a conversation and that was wonderful to see. If you are a translator, you use language patterns and basic skills - but only knowlegde of culture and people experience and life can teach you to feel what a right translation is. The remark of Hoshi reminds me of this: she comes across as a snob when she is refering to Trip beining without educuation - while her own job is best served by a combination of head and heart.
As for the *the_abomination*: the first thought I had watching that show: I can do a better one and my language isn't even English. The whole message was so negative and twisted and insulting.... well, we all agree on this, don't we?

[honeybee]

I still like the "it's a generally known legend, which sounds so convincing at the first time, but simply isn't true" idea concerning Trip's education.

Right. Think of Abraham Lincoln - who very much played up his humble beginnings and his lack of schooling when he ran for office. The truth is that he was rigorously home schooled in the classics by a highly educated (unusually educated for the times) stepmother who essentially served as a private tutor. And while he didn't go to University, he served an apprenticeship with a fine Springfield attorney that was the equivalent of law school (formal law schools were rare), passed the bar and for a couple of decades was one of the best lawyers in his state. But people embraced the notion that he was this humble, self-taught rail splitter - and Lincoln, who was a shrewd politician - encouraged this while being irritated at having to downplay his professional accomplishments, which were many.

I'm still of the camp that Starfleet sent Trip to get all the schooling he needed - MIT, Cal Tech. . .wherever he needed to go. But I can also see Trip downplaying his education for social reasons and because he's not the type to brag and it is useful when people underestimate you.

[Aikiweezie]

The whole message was so negative and twisted and insulting.... well, we all agree on this, don't we?

I think this IS something we all agree on. I don't remember anyone defending it on this board.

[WarpGirl]

Honestly I can't understand why Trip haters or Archer lovers defend it either. I mean even if you cut Trip and TnT out of the equation entirely it was just bad. Its like the TV equivilant of ST:V. I mean no matter how much you love a character, or how well they act, there was nothing redeemable about it. And I say that as a devoted Jonathan Frakes, Mirina Sirtis, and Brent Spiner fan. The concept was bad, the time it was set was just horrifying, it was just bad. And that's no matter what you ship for. In the case of *the_abomination*, she shipping was the least of its problems. Nobody came out looking good. Not even the hero!

[Aikiweezie]

Honestly I can't understand why Trip haters or Archer lovers defend it either. I mean even if you cut Trip and TnT out of the equation entirely it was just bad. Its like the TV equivilant of ST:V. I mean no matter how much you love a character, or how well they act, there was nothing redeemable about it. And I say that as a devoted Jonathan Frakes, Mirina Sirtis, and Brent Spiner fan. The concept was bad, the time it was set was just horrifying, it was just bad. And that's no matter what you ship for. In the case of *the_abomination*, she shipping was the least of its problems. Nobody came out looking good. Not even the hero!

Well put.