To Brave the Storm

[Alelou]

I'd have a hard time riffing on them because I've yet to get through one, though I've certainly skipped to certain scenes and enjoyed them. Like Transwarp, I truly just couldn't buy Trip as a spy. I also have very little enthusiasm for Romulans. So that was an unfortunate combination of plot lines for me.

I used to adore the old original series books (once they got out of James Blish territory anyway). Maybe they had more freedom, since that was in that long dark period between the show and the movies. Or maybe I was just more desperate. Or maybe I just didn't feel that terrible need to put my favorite couple together with that show. All I needed was a plot and Kirk and Spock and the gang. With Ent, if it's not TnT I'm just not terribly interested. That was my downfall with the TNG stuff too. I was a shipper; the books never recognized the ship, since that would break canon; ergo, I stopped reading the books. But fanfic is like crack for shippers, and I am a TnT crack ho.

[panyasan]

I don't mind an discussion on the egde, in fact I rather like it. As long if there is also room for people with a different opinion (giving voice to everyone) and I never saw the need to abandon civility. Guess I would make a brilliant diplomat.

[EntAllat]

I purchased all of the books. Did you?

Yup. I have every single Star Trek book ever published including a couple of rare ones. In case it wasn't obvious, I'm passionate about the books.

Look, you and everybody else are entitled to your opinion, be it positive or negative. Let's make one thing crystal clear - I did not in any way imply you should lie and say you like something you don't, nor did I say you couldn't grouse about what you don't like. I'm certainly saying you should shut down healthy debate and discussion of the strengths or weaknesses of the novels.

I just presented a simple opinion: I think the grousing stinks and is probably a factor in why we're not getting any more novels. Personal opinion? Yeah. Overly direct and blunt? Probably, but it was honest. For the record, I don't mind that you think my attitude in championing the novels stinks, either. No hard feelings.

If the books were good and getting cancelled I'd work harder trying to get people to purchase and read the books. Can you honestly tell me that the books were good?

Yes. Absolutely! I can honestly tell you that I thought the books were good. I've enjoyed reading them, and look forward to them, though I could probably point out places in each where I would have chosen a different path. I don't share your opinion that all the novels were bad. (There are hits and misses and stellar and weak authors, about the same as I find in fanfic. There's one ENT I didn't like and one TOS that was pretty bad, my memory is hazy on my opinion of the TNG, VOY and DS9 ones since it's been so long since I read them.)

So, no, I'm not lying either, just for the sake of being the mythical good fan. This ain't no fake cheerleading going on here - I seriously like the books, and I'm willing to champion 'em with as much passion as others will put into criticizing and debating them.

Speaking as a former aquisitions editor (for Simon & Schuster at the time, actually, but a different division), I can attest to this. The only thing that really matters is sales. Nobody cares what some Star Trek fans are saying if the Star Trek fans aren't also buying.

If I wanted as an acq ed to make a case for taking the business risk on another Enterprise novel, I would suggest possible reasons the books haven't sold that well, and suggest giving it another shot at building sales with books that don't rely on this weird relaunch scenario but instead go back to the spirit of the original show. However, my hands might be tied, because CBS/Paramount gets the veto on what goes on in these books and they appear to be wedded to *the_abomination*. You can also bet that they will veto any interesting relationship developments that don't fit their idea of canon. And this is the usual reason that the profic, even well-executed, is just not as interesting to me as the fanfic. Fanfic doesn't have to get the corporate seal of approval. Things can actually happen to change characters in permanent ways in fanfic. I'm just thankful the corporation hasn't decided to try to shut down the fans, because, frankly, fanfic IS competition for the books. (If you could get everyone to stop writing fanfic, you might grow a hungry market for the profic again, as in the old pre-internet days.) Of course, a clever marketer could probably create profitable synergies between the two worlds that support strong sales in this new environment. Unfortunately, publishing companies are so understaffed these days that even a very clever marketer probably wouldn't have time, staff, or money to make that happen. If authors don't do it themselves, it seldom happens.

This is probably the most useful thing I've heard so far in regards to the possible business decisions being made by the publisher. Thank you.

Anyway, I know I also get very tired of knee-jerk negativity about the show and the writers, but there is such a thing as being allowed to have an honest exchange of opinions in a discussion forum. Honestly, I'll take freewheeling discussion that verges into negativity over enforced niceness any day. (Of coure, this may be because I personally can't ever seem to manage to maintain niceness at the level some people seem to require.)

[/quote]

I can see I've hurt some feelings and stirred up a hornet's nest here. My apologies - I'm not even a regular here, so I'll just leave it at that and bow out. Thank you all for the opportunity to mention the campaign to save the novels.

[Transwarp]

I can see I've hurt some feelings and stirred up a hornet's nest here.

Hornet's nest? Pfffft. This is nothing!

For the record, you did not hurt my feelings and I never once felt that you thought I (or anyone else) was not entitled to our opinion. Your posts were reasoned and respectful. And while I'm speaking for the record, I completely understand that you actually *liked* the books, and I have no issues with that. My tastes are not yours and vice-versa. (It would be a dull world indeed if that were the case.) I'm pretty sure there are others on the board who share your enjoyment of the books.

I'm not even a regular here, so I'll just leave it at that and bow out.

Or stay and stir the anthill a little more?

[Alelou]

I don't mind an discussion on the egde, in fact I rather like it. As long if there is also room for people with a different opinion (giving voice to everyone) and I never saw the need to abandon civility. Guess I would make a brilliant diplomat.

Good for you. You will probably be amused to hear that my career goal going out of high school was to become a diplomat, because life has definitely taught me that it's not one of my skill sets. Not online, anyway. Maybe I hold my tongue more in real life.

[panyasan]

Good for you. You will probably be amused to hear that my career goal going out of high school was to become a diplomat, because life has definitely taught me that it's not one of my skill sets. Not online, anyway. Maybe I hold my tongue more in real life.

Luckily I married an undiplomatic man, otherwise life would be very boring.

[tambo2063]

[b]WOW you guys have really been going at it haven't been here in a few days busy reading fan fiction. I liked the books reason #1 it brought one of my favorite characters back Commander Charles Tucker III. #2 it got Trip & T'Pol together. Maybe its not how I would have imiaged it or maybe one of you might have had a better storyline I don't know but I will take what I can get it beats the hell out of the so called Enterprise finale that we got. My a**HOLE IS STILL RAW FROM THAT VALENTINE. Sorry if I hurt any feelings with that last remark. Now I can see the section using Trip as a "spy". He would have the skills that they needed, He understands warp drives & the warp engine. I may have missed something in the first book but i believe section31 was trying to stop or slow down the Romulons from getting to warp 7 i believe. So who ever went would have to know something about that and also he went with a partner who had some experience in the spy part. It might not make a damn in the universe but i going to send letters and try to get more books about Enterprise.

[Transwarp]

section31 was trying to stop or slow down the Romulons from getting to warp 7 i believe. So who ever went would have to know something about that

And also know a little something about being Romulan. Like, oh I don't know, how to speak Romulan?

[putaro]

I'm glad some people enjoyed the books. I just wish we could get some books that hold their own and don't have to be "well, be glad you got something"

Weren't a lot of the mid 80's Star Trek books pretty good books in their own right? I didn't read too many of them but I do have a copy of "How Much For Just The Planet" which was a riot.

[tambo2063]

I realize everyone has their own likes and dislikes and i feel we are all adults here. I love pepsi but if I can't get one i will settle for a coke when i am thirsty. as for being able to speak romulan , page 151 of THE GOOD THAT MEN DO "So far, no human has ever seen what a Romulan looks like," Trip said. "So I take it that the Adigeons know a lot more about that subject than we do." "That's correct, although the Adigeons have been well paid to keep such secrets to themselves. But thanks to a highly bribable Adigeon plastic surgeon, you and I will be going under the knife. We'll not only receive all the appropriate surgical alterations, we'll also be fitted with ear-implanted translation devices to help us communicate with any Romulans we encounter. By this time tomorrow, our own mothers probably won't recognize us." Phuong said. Still loving Trip & T'Pol and any story line that brings them together. Oh I also believe that if they were cut they would bleed green.

[putaro]

Unfortunately the embedded translator idea just didn't work for me and it's so central to the plot that it's hard to enjoy the story.

[Transwarp]

we'll also be fitted with ear-implanted translation devices to help us communicate with any Romulans we encounter.

An earbud would perhaps let them understand what the romulans were saying, but at some point Trip has to say something back. As soon as he does, it's 'game over' The Romulan sheriff moseys up to him and says "You ain't from these-here parts, are ya, boy." or the rommie equivalent.

I'm sorry, I DID read the first two books, but that simple, basic, OBVIOUS, requirement was never addressed. Anyone who hopes to infiltrate rommie society had better know something about it, including how to speak the language, which fork to use, how to tie his shoes, and who won the D'raviz Series. It was almost as if the authors, realizing they had no solution, just glossed over it, hoping nobody would notice.

Clearly a few of us did.

Oh I also believe that if they were cut they would bleed green.

Good for casual contact, perhaps, but it doesn't change his body temperature, heart rate, or the fact his major organs are in the wrong place.

To me, these books had the feel of being quickly dashed together. I like my TnT as much as the next guy, but the obstacles this book threw in my way were just too much for me to overcome

[Asso]

My dislike for the books is based on many reasons, some of which are already said, but I must also say that it starts from far away.

They are based on a premise that is in itself unacceptable (not to say the least): the breaking, for reasons completely incomprehensible, of the relationship between Trip and T'Pol after the death of their daughter. In fact the writers are well aware of this nonsense (do you remember those hands that weave in what can only be considered - in effect - the true end of the series?)

In fact, the writers try - desperately - to explain this problem, however, by means of explanations to say the least futile, silly and childish.

From this assumption, to say the least absurd, it derives the unacceptability of the rest. For example the fact that T'Pol is kept ignorant of what actually happens to Trip (by the way, and the Bond, what happened of it?).

And also ... well, maybe it's better that I stop here.

[Transwarp]

Addendum:
I understand lots of people actually liked the books, for a variety of reasons. We all have different hot buttons and thresholds of pain. I don't want ANYONE to think or feel that I am trying to belittle them because they don't agree with me. I am not implying, and I do not believe, that anyone who didn't see or object to the same implausibilities that I saw in the book is not as 'smart' as me. That is not my intention at all. My wife the Criminal Justice major has a completely different perspective on things than does her husband the Electrical Engineer. IDIC, and all that.

Having said that... I'm right and you're wrong! Neener-neener!!

[Reanok]

[b]WOW you guys have really been going at it haven't been here in a few days busy reading fan fiction. I liked the books reason #1 it brought one of my favorite characters back Commander Charles Tucker III. #2 it got Trip & T'Pol together. Maybe its not how I would have imiaged it or maybe one of you might have had a better storyline I don't know but I will take what I can get it beats the hell out of the so called Enterprise finale that we got. My a**HOLE IS STILL RAW FROM THAT VALENTINE. Sorry if I hurt any feelings with that last remark. Now I can see the section using Trip as a "spy". He would have the skills that they needed, He understands warp drives & the warp engine. I may have missed something in the first book but i believe section31 was trying to stop or slow down the Romulans from getting to warp 7 i believe. So who ever went would have to know something about that and also he went with a partner who had some experience in the spy part. It might not make a damn in the universe but i going to send letters and try to get more books about Enterprise.

Like Tambo I like the Enterprise novels and liked reading them. I'm glad they got Trip&T'Pol together at long last.I also want to see the Enterpise book line continue.I like reading fanfiction people can still like the fanfiction and still like reading the Enterprise books. I want to see the Enterprise books continue beyond To Brave the storm . I don't care for the Tng books for fans of the other Startrek series we'd like to see other novels published besides the same story told over and over again like a broken record like they do in the Typhon pact books.That seem to have endless sequels whilefans want Enterprise,Tos or ds9 novels.